TMLfans.ca

Maple Leafs News and Views => Leafs Rumours & Speculation => Topic started by: RedLeaf on June 21, 2012, 05:00:38 PM

Title: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: RedLeaf on June 21, 2012, 05:00:38 PM
Staal won't sign extension with PIT... getting interesting on that front. Could the Leafs offer more? Or does he have his sites on Carolina?

Bob McKenzie ‏@TSNBobMcKenzie
Breaking news: Hearing Jordan Staal turned down 10-yr mega offer from PIT. Has indicated to PIT he doesn't plan on signing extension now.

Bob McKenzie ‏@TSNBobMcKenzie
Let Jordan Staal trade rumors begin...full details on SC at 6 pm ET, on Insider Trader segment.

Bob McKenzie ‏@TSNBobMcKenzie
If Staal won't re-up in PIT, where he loves it, not expected to extend with anyone else who may trade for him. Except perhaps Carolina.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumours heating up
Post by: Madferret on June 21, 2012, 05:02:04 PM
So what's the rumor?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumours heating up
Post by: RedLeaf on June 21, 2012, 05:03:47 PM
So what's the rumor?

Line up. They're gonna hit you like a ? hurricane ?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumours heating up
Post by: Bender on June 21, 2012, 05:31:31 PM
So what's the rumor?

Line up. They're gonna hit rock you like a hurricane


Fixed it  :)
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: bustaheims on June 21, 2012, 05:37:24 PM
Well, that seals end. Jordan Staal's trade value just took a massive hit. How much you gonna give up for one year of a guy who doesn't appear willing to consider an extension?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Jalili on June 21, 2012, 05:38:42 PM
Staal on Carolina would be pretty cool to witness
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Bender on June 21, 2012, 05:49:12 PM
Well, that seals end. Jordan Staal's trade value just took a massive hit. How much you gonna give up for one year of a guy who doesn't appear willing to consider an extension?

(http://i.qkme.me/3opmxz.jpg)
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumours heating up
Post by: RedLeaf on June 21, 2012, 05:52:49 PM
So what's the rumor?

Line up. They're gonna hit rock you like a hurricane


Fixed it  :)

Better... ;D
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Bullfrog on June 21, 2012, 05:58:22 PM
Well, that seals end. Jordan Staal's trade value just took a massive hit. How much you gonna give up for one year of a guy who doesn't appear willing to consider an extension?

1h45m flight from Billy Bishop airport to his/my home town of Thunder Bay, where he and his other brothers own adjacent lakeshore property.

Just saying.  :P
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: bustaheims on June 21, 2012, 05:59:24 PM
1h45m flight from Billy Bishop airport to his/my home town of Thunder Bay, where he and his other brothers own adjacent lakeshore property.

Just saying.  :P

And, I said in another thread, similar things have been said about dozens of other players, and how has that worked out for the Leafs?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: bustaheims on June 21, 2012, 06:00:58 PM
Who said anything about windmills? Staal pretty much just confirmed he's a one year rental. That negatively impacts his trade value.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Bender on June 21, 2012, 06:06:35 PM
Who said anything about windmills? Staal pretty much just confirmed he's a one year rental. That negatively impacts his trade value.

I wanted to be a contrarian. And have an excuse to throw Morbo in there  ;D
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: bustaheims on June 21, 2012, 06:13:18 PM
I wanted to be a contrarian. And have an excuse to throw Morbo in there  ;D

I will destroy you!
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Bullfrog on June 21, 2012, 07:19:21 PM
1h45m flight from Billy Bishop airport to his/my home town of Thunder Bay, where he and his other brothers own adjacent lakeshore property.

Just saying.  :P

And, I said in another thread, similar things have been said about dozens of other players, and how has that worked out for the Leafs?

Uh, it was a joke.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: bustaheims on June 21, 2012, 07:24:11 PM
Uh, it was a joke.

Well, you know that, and I know that, but a number of people would have taken that ball and ran with it.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: CarltonTheBear on June 21, 2012, 07:25:11 PM
Hey guys I read on twitter the Staal's all want to come to Toronto to be closer to their summer homes.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Etiam Vultus on June 21, 2012, 07:26:25 PM
Has Jordan Stall actually said that he wants to play with one of his brothers, or is this just speculation?

I understand that he has said that he wants to play a bigger role on a team than the third line centre.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Bullfrog on June 21, 2012, 07:38:23 PM
Hey guys I read on twitter the Staal's all want to come to Toronto to be closer to their summer homes.

True story: I just got 4 cubic yards of soil delivered to my home from Staal's Sod and Soil farm. The delivery driver had a TML cap.

I'm not saying this means anything, but.......
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: AvroArrow on June 21, 2012, 07:39:21 PM
I really hope he's looking to be a first line center....  As much as I've never been a big JStaal guy, I'd welcome him here in open arms.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: BlueWhiteBlood on June 21, 2012, 07:41:42 PM
I really hope he's looking to be a first line center....  As much as I've never been a big JStaal guy, I'd welcome him here in open arms.

I was skeptical about his 1st line potential before as well, but after seeing him this season, I think that if he has that burning desire to be the guy, that he can pull it off. In Carolina, he'd only be the second guy.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: caveman on June 21, 2012, 07:55:54 PM
Hey guys I read on twitter the Staal's all want to come to Toronto to be closer to their summer homes.

True story: I just got 4 cubic yards of soil delivered to my home from Staal's Sod and Soil farm. The delivery driver had a TML cap.

I'm not saying this means anything, but.......

Finally... we get the dirt on the Staal trade....    ;D
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Britishbulldog on June 21, 2012, 08:22:08 PM
Hey guys I read on twitter the Staal's all want to come to Toronto to be closer to their summer homes.

True story: I just got 4 cubic yards of soil delivered to my home from Staal's Sod and Soil farm. The delivery driver had a TML cap.

I'm not saying this means anything, but.......

Finally... we get the dirt on the Staal trade....    ;D

Boooo.....

...I love it.  ;)
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: AvroArrow on June 21, 2012, 10:46:31 PM
I really hope he's looking to be a first line center....  As much as I've never been a big JStaal guy, I'd welcome him here in open arms.

I was skeptical about his 1st line potential before as well, but after seeing him this season, I think that if he has that burning desire to be the guy, that he can pull it off. In Carolina, he'd only be the second guy.

Even if he tops out as a second line centre, I'd much rather have two 2nd line centres than what we've had the last several years.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Peter D. on June 21, 2012, 11:22:37 PM
I really hope he's looking to be a first line center....  As much as I've never been a big JStaal guy, I'd welcome him here in open arms.

I'm of this line of thought as well. He may represent our best option of obtaining a 1st line centre (even though I don't think of him as a true #1; but also believe he could grow into it).

I don't think a contract extension would be difficult to hammer out with him if he were here. Only thing I see getting in the way is him desiring to play with Eric in Carolina.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: TML fan on June 22, 2012, 02:37:45 AM
Maybe he wants to play with Mark in New York?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: A Weekend at Bernier's on June 22, 2012, 12:31:44 PM
I really hope he's looking to be a first line center....  As much as I've never been a big JStaal guy, I'd welcome him here in open arms.

I'm of this line of thought as well. He may represent our best option of obtaining a 1st line centre (even though I don't think of him as a true #1; but also believe he could grow into it).

I don't think a contract extension would be difficult to hammer out with him if he were here. Only thing I see getting in the way is him desiring to play with Eric in Carolina.

Shoot, while we're at it, bring Eric here, too.  ;D
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: 50 Mission Cap on June 22, 2012, 12:34:17 PM
I really hope he's looking to be a first line center....  As much as I've never been a big JStaal guy, I'd welcome him here in open arms.

I'm of this line of thought as well. He may represent our best option of obtaining a 1st line centre (even though I don't think of him as a true #1; but also believe he could grow into it).

I don't think a contract extension would be difficult to hammer out with him if he were here. Only thing I see getting in the way is him desiring to play with Eric in Carolina.

Shoot, while we're at it, bring Eric here, too.  ;D

Seeing as how he turned down a 10 year extension with Pitts I doubt he'll sign an extension with anyone. He's earned the right to test free agency and I think he intends on doing just that. I will say if he's let it be known that he won't sign an extention then that can only hurt his value a bit. It's a huge risk for a team to offer up premium prospects or picks for a guy that may only play one season for them.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: bustaheims on June 22, 2012, 12:35:17 PM
I don't think a contract extension would be difficult to hammer out with him if he were here. Only thing I see getting in the way is him desiring to play with Eric in Carolina.

That's not the impression I get from what happened yesterday. He turned down $60M from Pittsburgh and his agent came out and said he's not interested in signing an extension "at this time." He may change his mind down the road, but, I wouldn't bank on it. I certainly wouldn't give up significant assets with that massive unknown sitting out there.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: A Weekend at Bernier's on June 22, 2012, 12:40:31 PM
I don't think a contract extension would be difficult to hammer out with him if he were here. Only thing I see getting in the way is him desiring to play with Eric in Carolina.

That's not the impression I get from what happened yesterday. He turned down $60M from Pittsburgh and his agent came out and said he's not interested in signing an extension "at this time." He may change his mind down the road, but, I wouldn't bank on it. I certainly wouldn't give up significant assets with that massive unknown sitting out there.

I'm sure these sorts of things happen all the time (contractual discussions, that is).  Why do you suppose this rather insignificant event made its way to MacKenzie and then out to the world?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Frank E on June 22, 2012, 12:42:39 PM
I don't think a contract extension would be difficult to hammer out with him if he were here. Only thing I see getting in the way is him desiring to play with Eric in Carolina.

That's not the impression I get from what happened yesterday. He turned down $60M from Pittsburgh and his agent came out and said he's not interested in signing an extension "at this time." He may change his mind down the road, but, I wouldn't bank on it. I certainly wouldn't give up significant assets with that massive unknown sitting out there.

If indeed Staal has suggested that he wants to go the UFA route, big if, then I would imagine he has more value to Pittsburgh than to another team right now.  It would seem to me that he'll be working his tail off for a big UFA deal, and Pittsburgh has what it takes to take another run at the cup with him on the team.   
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: bustaheims on June 22, 2012, 12:44:32 PM
I'm sure these sorts of things happen all the time (contractual discussions, that is).  Why do you suppose this rather insignificant event made its way to MacKenzie and then out to the world?

It's not so insignificant. It's a high profile player, a significant extension that was flat out turned down and his agent publicly announced that he wasn't interested in signing an extension. That's a pretty big deal at this time of the year. It puts big name pretty squarely on the trade market.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 12:45:57 PM
If indeed Staal has suggested that he wants to go the UFA route, big if, then I would imagine he has more value to Pittsburgh than to another team right now.  It would seem to me that he'll be working his tail off for a big UFA deal, and Pittsburgh has what it takes to take another run at the cup with him on the team.

Except the argument with Staal has always been that his position on the Penguins kind of hampers his ability to put up the kind of year that would result in a huge contract. I'm sure he'll be motivated to play well but if he's a #3 centre and puts up 45-50 points I wonder how well he'll do as a UFA.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 12:49:47 PM
It's not so insignificant. It's a high profile player, a significant extension that was flat out turned down and his agent publicly announced that he wasn't interested in signing an extension. That's a pretty big deal at this time of the year. It puts big name pretty squarely on the trade market.

The thing that jumped out to me about the story is the reported number of the extension Pittsburgh offered. Both it's term and it's AAV strike me as sort of an admission by the Penguins that they think he's a better player than their depth allows him to be and also that Staal, if he does hit the UFA market, is intent on either signing a massive deal or has somewhere very specfic in mind in terms of where he wants to play.

Either way, I would not be confident about being able to work out an extension.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: sneakyray on June 22, 2012, 12:54:28 PM
If indeed Staal has suggested that he wants to go the UFA route, big if, then I would imagine he has more value to Pittsburgh than to another team right now.  It would seem to me that he'll be working his tail off for a big UFA deal, and Pittsburgh has what it takes to take another run at the cup with him on the team.

Except the argument with Staal has always been that his position on the Penguins kind of hampers his ability to put up the kind of year that would result in a huge contract. I'm sure he'll be motivated to play well but if he's a #3 centre and puts up 45-50 points I wonder how well he'll do as a UFA.

somebody will pay him...just think of ville leino.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 12:57:18 PM
somebody will pay him...just think of ville leino.

If he's turning down 10 years and 60 million dollars because it's not enough then I sincerely doubt anyone's going to step up to that plate.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Zee on June 22, 2012, 12:58:10 PM
somebody will pay him...just think of ville leino.

If he's turning down 10 years and 60 million dollars because it's not enough then I sincerely doubt anyone's going to step up to that plate.

Especially not Burke and his "I don't do long contracts" spiel.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: bustaheims on June 22, 2012, 01:00:49 PM
Especially not Burke and his "I don't do long contracts" spiel.

I think Burke has loosened his stance there - he's pretty much admitted he'll have to in order to compete in the UFA market in the future. He just won't sign a deal that he feels includes any cap related shenanigans.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Peter D. on June 22, 2012, 01:02:48 PM
I don't think a contract extension would be difficult to hammer out with him if he were here. Only thing I see getting in the way is him desiring to play with Eric in Carolina.

That's not the impression I get from what happened yesterday. He turned down $60M from Pittsburgh and his agent came out and said he's not interested in signing an extension "at this time." He may change his mind down the road, but, I wouldn't bank on it. I certainly wouldn't give up significant assets with that massive unknown sitting out there.

I didn't catch wind of the dollar amount.  An average of $6M a year over 10 years?  For Jordan Staal?  That seems to me more of him wanting to get out due to being no more than a 3rd liner in the the shadow of Crosby and Malkin than it is about money.

If put in the right position to succeed (behind his bro in Carolina, 1st line in Toronto), I do believe he'd be more inclined to sign an extension.  I'd be shocked if he hit free agency and actually got more than $6M per, let alone over the term that Pittsburgh offered him.  Completely shocked to be honest. 
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:03:31 PM
I think Burke has loosened his stance there - he's pretty much admitted he'll have to in order to compete in the UFA market in the future. He just won't sign a deal that he feels includes any cap related shenanigans.

So...all of them?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Zee on June 22, 2012, 01:04:29 PM
I think Burke has loosened his stance there - he's pretty much admitted he'll have to in order to compete in the UFA market in the future. He just won't sign a deal that he feels includes any cap related shenanigans.

So...all of them?

 :D :D :D

Yeah I'll believe it when I see it.  The day Burke signs a contract >7 years I'll be the first to admit I was wrong about him.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: bustaheims on June 22, 2012, 01:05:41 PM
I think Burke has loosened his stance there - he's pretty much admitted he'll have to in order to compete in the UFA market in the future. He just won't sign a deal that he feels includes any cap related shenanigans.

So...all of them?

Well, no. DiPietro's contract has no shenanigans. Well, at least, none that are cap related. ;)
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:09:36 PM
If put in the right position to succeed (behind his bro in Carolina, 1st line in Toronto), I do believe he'd be more inclined to sign an extension. 

I don't understand that line of thinking. Why is he in a better position to succeed in Toronto? It's a worse team.

Don't get too hung up on the idea of Jordan Staal as a "3rd liner". His average ice times the last four years have been 19:51, 19:24, 21:21 and 20:03. Going elsewhere isn't going to increase his ice time much(he ranked 27th among forwards in the entire league) and outside of changing up his ratio of PP/PK time, which would strike me as diminishing his value, I don't see what the appeal is.

I mean, unless the argument is that Jordan Staal will be happier in a place where he's more of a big deal or where his personal stats look better, I really don't see what would be better for him in Toronto.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: BlueWhiteBlood on June 22, 2012, 01:11:16 PM
Especially not Burke and his "I don't do long contracts" spiel.

I think Burke has loosened his stance there - he's pretty much admitted he'll have to in order to compete in the UFA market in the future. He just won't sign a deal that he feels includes any cap related shenanigans.

I remember him saying that for the right player, he'll definitely go beyond his 5 year usual. You'd have to think that a center with Jordan's age and skill set, he'd be one that Burke would go well beyond 5 years on.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:12:54 PM
Well, no. DiPietro's contract has no shenanigans. Well, at least, none that are cap related. ;)

Well, so long as he's ok with the DiPietro contract.

Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Zee on June 22, 2012, 01:13:03 PM
Especially not Burke and his "I don't do long contracts" spiel.

I think Burke has loosened his stance there - he's pretty much admitted he'll have to in order to compete in the UFA market in the future. He just won't sign a deal that he feels includes any cap related shenanigans.

I remember him saying that for the right player, he'll definitely go beyond his 5 year usual. You'd have to think that a center with Jordan's age and skill set, he'd be one that Burke would go well beyond 5 years on.

It's going to be tough to make that trade.  I still think he has his sights set on Carolina and playing with his brother.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: BlueWhiteBlood on June 22, 2012, 01:15:16 PM
It's going to be tough to make that trade.  I still think he has his sights set on Carolina and playing with his brother.

As was said, if the problem is indeed that he wants to play a bigger role, rather than being behind better players, why would he leave to go and play behind his brother of all people?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:16:26 PM
I remember him saying that for the right player, he'll definitely go beyond his 5 year usual. You'd have to think that a center with Jordan's age and skill set, he'd be one that Burke would go well beyond 5 years on.

I'll be honest, it's not an idea that fills me with a ton of confidence. As good a player as Staal has been signing him to a very long term, high value contract strikes me as kind of crazy. He's never proven himself to be a #1 centre. Why would a team lock up #1 centre money in him for a long term before then?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: LeafsInSeven on June 22, 2012, 01:17:30 PM
Plummeting trade value for Staal in Pittsburgh makes me smile. I'm tired of everything falling into Pittsburgh's lap.

I would talk to Pittsburgh then Staal's agent (with permission) about whether he'd consider signing an extension if he moved to Toronto. He may just not want to sign an extension in Pittsburgh. He may want to spread his wings and all that and get out from behind Malkin's and Crosby's shadows. Something tells me the rumours could be true that he's just planning on signing with Carolina in 2013 because his brother likes it there. It's apparently a very liveable area in North Carolina.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Peter D. on June 22, 2012, 01:17:30 PM
I don't understand that line of thinking. Why is he in a better position to succeed in Toronto? It's a worse team.

Don't get too hung up on the idea of Jordan Staal as a "3rd liner". His average ice times the last four years have been 19:51, 19:24, 21:21 and 20:03. Going elsewhere isn't going to increase his ice time much(he ranked 27th among forwards in the entire league) and outside of changing up his ratio of PP/PK time, which would strike me as diminishing his value, I don't see what the appeal is.

I mean, unless the argument is that Jordan Staal will be happier in a place where he's more of a big deal or where his personal stats look better, I really don't see what would be better for him in Toronto.

Well, isn't your last paragraph pretty much it?

Because if this was about being in the best position  to succeed from a team standpoint as you initially mention, I don't see how he could be foolish not to sign long-term, at good money, with his team that has arguably the league's two best players and who could/should legitimately contend for a Cup over the duration of the contract offered to him.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:21:24 PM
Well, isn't your last paragraph pretty much it?

Because if this was about being in the best position  to succeed from a team standpoint as you initially mention, I don't see how he could be foolish not to sign long-term, at good money, with his team that has arguably the league's two best players and who could/should legitimately contend for a Cup over the duration of the contract offered to him.

Well, and not to go too heavy into crusty old sportswriter mode here but if that argument holds then you're talking about a guy who thinks winning is less important than his own personal statistics which, if loud shouting morons on sports talk radio have taught me anything, makes him a terrible player unworthy of our affections.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: BlueWhiteBlood on June 22, 2012, 01:21:36 PM
I'll be honest, it's not an idea that fills me with a ton of confidence. As good a player as Staal has been signing him to a very long term, high value contract strikes me as kind of crazy. He's never proven himself to be a #1 centre. Why would a team lock up #1 centre money in him for a long term before then?

I have felt the same way about him in the past, I just feel now that he has matured and had an extra gear last year. Plus, if he's motivated to be the big man on campus with a team, what better stage than Toronto? I think he'd find that extra gear if he got his wish.

I also think that if he was playing with Kessel and Lupul, he'd put up at least 20 extra points.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Zee on June 22, 2012, 01:26:12 PM
It's going to be tough to make that trade.  I still think he has his sights set on Carolina and playing with his brother.

As was said, if the problem is indeed that he wants to play a bigger role, rather than being behind better players, why would he leave to go and play behind his brother of all people?

That may be just speculation.  Maybe he doesn't like playing 3rd fiddle behind Crosby and Malkin but will be more than happy to be a good 1-2 punch with his brother.  I'd want to play with my brother if I could.  It's more of a motivation then it would be coming to the Leafs right now. 
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:26:39 PM
I have felt the same way about him in the past, I just feel now that he has matured and had an extra gear last year. Plus, if he's motivated to be the big man on campus with a team, what better stage than Toronto? I think he'd find that extra gear if he got his wish.

I also think that if he was playing with Kessel and Lupul, he'd put up at least 20 extra points.

There's about three "ifs" too many in your post for me to feel like giving him a gigantic contract is in any team's best interests. If you're committing a huge contract to someone I think it's got to at least in part reflect what they've already shown they can do.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Peter D. on June 22, 2012, 01:27:19 PM
Well, and not to go too heavy into crusty old sportswriter mode here but if that argument holds then you're talking about a guy who thinks winning is less important than his own personal statistics which, if loud shouting morons on sports talk radio have taught me anything, makes him a terrible player unworthy of our affections.

While that may be true, he certainly isn't the first and definitely won't be the last player (especially someone as young as he is) who would rather have the chance to play a bigger role, even if it's on a lesser team. 
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Zee on June 22, 2012, 01:28:12 PM
I have felt the same way about him in the past, I just feel now that he has matured and had an extra gear last year. Plus, if he's motivated to be the big man on campus with a team, what better stage than Toronto? I think he'd find that extra gear if he got his wish.

I also think that if he was playing with Kessel and Lupul, he'd put up at least 20 extra points.

There's about three "ifs" too many in your post for me to feel like giving him a gigantic contract is in any team's best interests. If you're committing a huge contract to someone I think it's got to at least in part reflect what they've already shown they can do.

Well his contract is up after next season so you could conceivably let him start the year with your club, and if he fits in and is lighting up the scoresheet then you work on an extension as the season progresses.  Provided there's no lockout of course. :)
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:32:21 PM
While that may be true, he certainly isn't the first and definitely won't be the last player (especially someone as young as he is) who would rather have the chance to play a bigger role, even if it's on a lesser team.

But the issue there, again, is that his role in Pittsburgh isn't small(again, 27th in ATOI last year).

This isn't like Corey Schneider wanting to be a #1. Staal had the 16th highest ATOI for centres last year, more than Jason Spezza, Pavel Datsyuk and Henrik Sedin.

So, yeah, he may not be the first player who's all about himself but isn't that why you wouldn't want to invest in him for 8 or 10 years?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:34:36 PM
Well his contract is up after next season so you could conceivably let him start the year with your club, and if he fits in and is lighting up the scoresheet then you work on an extension as the season progresses.  Provided there's no lockout of course. :)

Sure and, to be clear, I'm not necessarily against trading for Jordan Staal. I just have absolutely no reason to think he'd be any more open to signing an extension here than he would be in Pittsburgh because, for what it's worth, I don't believe that he's as motivated by personal glory as others seem to.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: BlueWhiteBlood on June 22, 2012, 01:35:18 PM
There's about three "ifs" too many in your post for me to feel like giving him a gigantic contract is in any team's best interests. If you're committing a huge contract to someone I think it's got to at least in part reflect what they've already shown they can do.

Well, it's not like we know that he in fact wouldn't sign a smaller deal, he may sign a different deal with another team.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Zee on June 22, 2012, 01:36:59 PM
Well his contract is up after next season so you could conceivably let him start the year with your club, and if he fits in and is lighting up the scoresheet then you work on an extension as the season progresses.  Provided there's no lockout of course. :)

Sure and, to be clear, I'm not necessarily against trading for Jordan Staal. I just have absolutely no reason to think he'd be any more open to signing an extension here than he would be in Pittsburgh because, for what it's worth, I don't believe that he's as motivated by personal glory as others seem to.

Yep, only he and his agent I suppose, know what his motivations are.  Everything else is just speculation.  Maybe he would like a long term deal with the Leafs, maybe not.  I just can't see it happening.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:37:52 PM
Well, it's not like we know that he in fact wouldn't sign a smaller deal, he may sign a different deal with another team.

He might think dirt clods taste like ice cream, sure, but I'm just responding to your suggestion that the guy Burke would be willing to bend on is the guy who hadn't earned it.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Corn Flake on June 22, 2012, 01:37:53 PM
I also think that if he was playing with Kessel and Lupul, he'd put up at least 20 extra points.

Without a doubt.

The Pens will always be Crosby and Malkin's team. He has won there so taking a chance to go somewhere else, play a leading role and win again is not surprising at all for an ultra competitive athlete who probably feels he has a lot more to give.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Peter D. on June 22, 2012, 01:37:54 PM
But the issue there, again, is that his role in Pittsburgh isn't small(again, 27th in ATOI last year).

This isn't like Corey Schneider wanting to be a #1. Staal had the 16th highest ATOI for centres last year, more than Jason Spezza, Pavel Datsyuk and Henrik Sedin.

So, yeah, he may not be the first player who's all about himself but isn't that why you wouldn't want to invest in him for 8 or 10 years?

This is all fine and dandy. 

But if it's not about the role he plays, and it can't be the team he plays on, and I certainly hope it's not about the contract offered -- then I must be missing some reason(s) as to why he wouldn't jump on a contract like that.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Peter D. on June 22, 2012, 01:39:00 PM
I also think that if he was playing with Kessel and Lupul, he'd put up at least 20 extra points.

Without a doubt.

The Pens will always be Crosby and Malkin's team. He has won there so taking a chance to go somewhere else, play a leading role and win again is not surprising at all for an ultra competitive athlete who probably feels he has a lot more to give.

But isn't this the type of player we don't want?   :-\
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Zee on June 22, 2012, 01:42:42 PM
Man, he's only 24 this year.  I think he'd be the perfect fit on the Leafs, the center we covet and the right age to grow with the team.  Of course for those very reasons I think we won't get him.  I'm used to getting kicked in the nuts as a Leafs fan.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 01:43:21 PM
This is all fine and dandy. 

But if it's not about the role he plays, and it can't be the team he plays on, and I certainly hope it's not about the contract offered -- then I must be missing some reason(s) as to why he wouldn't jump on a contract like that.

Well, I mean, for starters the idea of free agency is appealing to a lot of players on its own merits. Maybe Jordan Staal doesn't like some of the other guys personally. Maybe he'd like to live somewhere else other than Pittsburgh. Maybe playing with one of his brothers is really important to him.

None of us know these things. All I'm saying is that we have pretty good evidence that Jordan Staal doesn't want to sign a long term extension right now and there's not much in the way to suggest being in Toronto would change that.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: BlueWhiteBlood on June 22, 2012, 01:49:32 PM
Well, it's not like we know that he in fact wouldn't sign a smaller deal, he may sign a different deal with another team.

He might think dirt clods taste like ice cream, sure, but I'm just responding to your suggestion that the guy Burke would be willing to bend on is the guy who hadn't earned it.

Depends what he and his scouts think I guess. I feel that he'll be motivated and possesses the skill to be the top guy and I think he is a guy that Burke would sign past 5 years for the same reasons. Maybe I'm wrong.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: lamajama on June 22, 2012, 02:16:13 PM
A couple of points here...I was surprised at his ice time but without actually looking it up, I would suspect a high TOI for the PK, which would reduce his
production. That being said, I would think he also sees more opportunity to offensively flourish while the other team's key in on Malkin and Crosby. In TO for example, he'd likely face the Top D line of the opposition.

All in all, as is usual with being a Leaf fan, if he's that good we ain't getting him...at least not without giving up the farm. Come to think of it...have MLSE buy the Staal's farm and then give it back if he comes to Toronto....
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: RedLeaf on June 22, 2012, 02:26:29 PM
A couple of points here...I was surprised at his ice time but without actually looking it up, I would suspect a high TOI for the PK, which would reduce his
production. That being said, I would think he also sees more opportunity to offensively flourish while the other team's key in on Malkin and Crosby. In TO for example, he'd likely face the Top D line of the opposition.

All in all, as is usual with being a Leaf fan, if he's that good we ain't getting him...at least not without giving up the farm. Come to think of it...have MLSE buy the Staal's farm and then give it back if he comes to Toronto....

Nice. Perhaps as a wedding gift?  8)
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Nik on June 22, 2012, 02:45:46 PM
A couple of points here...I was surprised at his ice time but without actually looking it up, I would suspect a high TOI for the PK, which would reduce his production.

He does get a ton of PK time but the point of me listing his ice time wasn't to denigrate him as an offensive player but rather as a counter to the idea that he was "buried" or that he was a "3rd line player". The Penguins have three centres that they've been giving #1 ice time to. If he changes teams his role is likely to change but I don't know if it'll get bigger. 

That being said, I would think he also sees more opportunity to offensively flourish while the other team's key in on Malkin and Crosby. In TO for example, he'd likely face the Top D line of the opposition.

There's some truth there but there's also the flipside that the role he's used in means that he's often matched up against the other team's best forwards which reduces his chances to score.

But for me the more pressing issue there is, I mean, Staal is a Selke nominated defensive forward. The reason he gets a lot of PK time and plays a lot of defensive hockey is because that's what he's so good at. I don't necessarily see that getting him and shifting him away from that is a good idea.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Significantly Insignificant on June 22, 2012, 02:47:38 PM
A couple of points here...I was surprised at his ice time but without actually looking it up, I would suspect a high TOI for the PK, which would reduce his production.

He does get a ton of PK time but the point of me listing his ice time wasn't to denigrate him as an offensive player but rather as a counter to the idea that he was "buried" or that he was a "3rd line player". The Penguins have three centres that they've been giving #1 ice time to. If he changes teams his role is likely to change but I don't know if it'll get bigger. 

That being said, I would think he also sees more opportunity to offensively flourish while the other team's key in on Malkin and Crosby. In TO for example, he'd likely face the Top D line of the opposition.

There's some truth there but there's also the flipside that the role he's used in means that he's often matched up against the other team's best forwards which reduces his chances to score.

But for me the more pressing issue there is, I mean, Staal is a Selke nominated defensive forward. The reason he gets a lot of PK time and plays a lot of defensive hockey is because that's what he's so good at. I don't necessarily see that getting him and shifting him away from that is a good idea.

Dougie, Part Duex.

In all seriousness though, I doubt Staal is coming to Toronto.  I think he wants to play in New York or Carolina. 
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: No.92 on June 22, 2012, 02:53:49 PM
I also think that if he was playing with Kessel and Lupul, he'd put up at least 20 extra points.

When I traded for him in NHL 2012 and put him as my 1st line center, we won the Stanley Cup.  :P
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Madferret on June 22, 2012, 08:18:39 PM
Another one bites the dust
Title: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Zee on June 22, 2012, 08:24:53 PM
Carolina like I thought.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: AvroArrow on June 22, 2012, 10:24:57 PM
We stink, dudes?
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: cw on June 24, 2012, 12:43:15 PM
I like Jordan Staal as a 2nd line center - not a 1st. I do think Malkin & Crosby clogging up the Pens center position had something to do with him turning down an incredible offer.

I do wonder if Jussi Jokinen becomes available with this trade. He's not as good or as defensively talented as Staal but he'd be an upgrade over Bozak while it looks like the Canes could use a winger (maybe MacArthur? +)
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: Corn Flake on June 24, 2012, 05:18:11 PM
We stink, dudes?

we didn`t have a Staal to get another Staal.. that was the problems.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: CarltonTheBear on June 24, 2012, 05:19:44 PM
We stink, dudes?

we didn`t have a Staal to get another Staal.. that was the problems.

Carolina paid a very high price I think too. The equivalent here would probably have been the 5th and Gardiner, and we had a much smaller chance of being able to sign him.

Sutter can very easily play the 3rd line centre role that Staal occupied in Pittsburgh just as good as Staal did, he just doesn't have the offensive potential that Staal had. Plus they got the 8th overall pick in return on top of that.
Title: Re: Jordan Staal rumors about to heat up
Post by: BlueWhiteBlood on July 01, 2012, 11:23:42 AM
Sportsnet is saying that Staal accepted the same contract from Carolina that Pittsburgh offered. 10 tears at 6 million a pop. Apparently it's a done deal as of 12 Noon.

#Canes GM Jim Rutherford says long-term Jordan Staal contract is done. Looks to be same as #Pens offer... 10 years, $6M cap hit per.
by Nichols_NHLPool via twitter 11:19 AM

TSN confirms... http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=399665