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Armchair GM Thread 2022-2023

Started by CarltonTheBear, May 16, 2022, 11:37:25 AM

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Joe

Quote from: bustaheims on June 14, 2022, 12:40:44 PM
Quote from: Iafrate on June 14, 2022, 11:48:11 AM
Maybe I don't get how it works. But I thought if you have a player on LTIR allows you to exceed the cap by the difference of the salary and the cap space available.

So if the player has a 5mil cap hit and you have 1 mil of cap space you can exceed the cap by 4 mil.

So why wouldn't this be beneficial? Or am I completely wrong in how this works?

As others have pointed out, it's not how it works - and, if it were, why would teams trade away that advantage? Why would they have to include assets to shed those contracts? It really boggles my mind how many media types, bloggers, etc., still get this wrong.

There are also some other wrinkles to LTIR that make it a disadvantage. For instance, LTIR space can't be used to absorb a pro-rated amount of a player's cap hit - you have to be able to fit the full season AAV regardless of what point in the season you acquire them. It also can't be used to account for performance bonuses, as it disappears when the season ends while performance bonuses aren't charged against the cap until after the season.

That's why I posted this asking. It wasn't a statement. I'm asking for someone to explain this plainly. I realize that I have this wrong, but the explanation still doesn't make any sense to me.

For example, why did the leafs take on Horton's contract? I'm not arguing at all, I genuinely don't get how it works.

bustaheims

#121
Quote from: Iafrate on June 14, 2022, 02:00:07 PM
For example, why did the leafs take on Horton's contract? I'm not arguing at all, I genuinely don't get how it works.

The Horton thing was about real dollars - his contract wasn't insured, so the Blue Jackets were still paying his salary. With limited resources, it was obviously in their interest to have those dollars going to an actual roster player. For the Leafs, it was an opportunity to move on from Clarkson and "free up" that cap space by turning it into potential LTIR space instead of using in on a useless Clarkson, as they have much lesser concerns re: actual dollars. Every penny of Horton's contract still counted against the cap, but the potential LTIR space gave the Leafs flexibility. It didn't create more space than they would have had without Horton's contract, but it did mean they could essentially re-use those cap dollars on other contracts.

That's probably the easiest way to look at it - it doesn't create additional space, but, rather, it allows space to be used twice. The team's functional cap ceiling remains the same (with some of the complications I mentioned in my previous post).
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

bustaheims

Quote from: L K on June 14, 2022, 01:57:43 PM
You have to be cap compliant before the start of the year so you can't take advantage of LTIR in the offseason unless you have handshake agreements to sign contracts the day after the calendar season goes into effect.

There are some exceptions here re: players who missed the entire season with a career ending injury. I'm not 100% clear on how it works, but teams do get some relief for these contracts in the offseason.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

L K

Quote from: bustaheims on June 14, 2022, 02:14:48 PM
Quote from: L K on June 14, 2022, 01:57:43 PM
You have to be cap compliant before the start of the year so you can't take advantage of LTIR in the offseason unless you have handshake agreements to sign contracts the day after the calendar season goes into effect.

There are some exceptions here re: players who missed the entire season with a career ending injury. I'm not 100% clear on how it works, but teams do get some relief for these contracts in the offseason.

Yeah.  That has to arbitrated by the NHL I think? 

bustaheims

Quote from: L K on June 14, 2022, 03:16:58 PM
Quote from: bustaheims on June 14, 2022, 02:14:48 PM
Quote from: L K on June 14, 2022, 01:57:43 PM
You have to be cap compliant before the start of the year so you can't take advantage of LTIR in the offseason unless you have handshake agreements to sign contracts the day after the calendar season goes into effect.

There are some exceptions here re: players who missed the entire season with a career ending injury. I'm not 100% clear on how it works, but teams do get some relief for these contracts in the offseason.

Yeah.  That has to arbitrated by the NHL I think?

I believe so, yeah.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Joe

Thank you busta that helps. And honestly I had completely forgotten that Clarkson went the other way. I had actually forgotten Clarkson ever existed actually.

bustaheims

Quote from: Iafrate on June 14, 2022, 05:02:37 PM
Thank you busta that helps. And honestly I had completely forgotten that Clarkson went the other way. I had actually forgotten Clarkson ever existed actually.

No problem. LTIR stuff gets misrepresented all the time, it's no wonder people get confused. It was as clear as mud when the cap first came into play, and a lot of the misinformation from then has remained.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

herman

#127
And then Clarkson came back on a magnificent LTIR deal
"Can't let the poison get to you"
#BeBlessed

herman

"Can't let the poison get to you"
#BeBlessed

bustaheims

#129
Quote from: herman on June 15, 2022, 11:17:48 AM
https://twitter.com/blueandwhite93/status/1536819228224983041

Direct quotes from Campbell's agent in an article on The Athletic refute the notion the Leafs haven't had dialogue on Campbell. There just isn't a huge sense of urgency with 4 weeks left before free agency opens.

Quote from: https://theathletic.com/3364930/2022/06/15/jack-campbell-maple-leafs-unrestricted-free-agent/"There's still so much time," Overhardt said, noting that teams, including the Leafs, were likely in the midst of, or had recently completed, their pro scouting meetings. "With Jack, obviously he's really interested in coming back and would be committed to do that. We continue to talk to the club, and we've got an open dialogue.

"Nothing to report other than that."

Also, Gibson has come out and denied the rumours of a trade request, so...
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

herman

"Can't let the poison get to you"
#BeBlessed

CarltonTheBear


herman

"Can't let the poison get to you"
#BeBlessed

bustaheims

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

herman

https://twitter.com/JhanHky/status/1542128520108937216
Bonus appearance/analysis by everyone's favourite (literally everyone here likes him)
"Can't let the poison get to you"
#BeBlessed