This PP is their last chance to have a last chance.

What a zero of a game.

90% of the Leaf games I watch I'm bored out of my mind. The product sucks.

I don't understand Reaves. First two games he really made an impact with his hits and fighting. Since then...Nothing.

Thing is this seems to be a Leaf problem. Guys who in the past have an edge to their game come to this team and play completely neutered. So is it the coach or the dressing room?

I'm talking playoffs, Matthews does what he does every year and normally the excuse is he's playing hurt.

Again TO could only score 2 goals, Matthews zero, superstars show up when it counts, no excuses well maybe occasionally but certainly not consistently like Matthews.

TO isn't going to do well in the playoffs relying on Matthews and he's only signed for one more year, time to move on.

Thank you for the post.  This is very enlightening.  I appreciate getting the perspective of the Leafs from the other side of the bell curve.

These are the same type of posters who then, years later say, "why did they give up on Kessel, see what a force he was in those 2 Cup wins? Why did they give up on Kadri, see what a force he was in that Cup win?". You can't win with these haters. Grass is always greener on the other side

It's almost like when those players were traded they went to new teams, with new coaches and new teammates. Nobody is saying these guys suck. It's just it isn't working here. The current mix is just not getting it done. It's time to move on.

I think it's time to really move on from this core. Matthews and Marner just can not get it done in this market come playoffs. They can't handle the pressure or whatever. Matthews will get a boatload in a trade. An American who was MVP last season and Rocket winner. Kings would be a great fit for him. Marner would bring in a huge return as well. Just makes sense to cash out while we can. We can retool and get some young players for next year. Sign Tom Wilson and let's go change the attitude of this team. Give fans something to be excited about again. Bring Boudreau in. We have been more than patient with this core. They've had their opportunities. It's time to move on.

Also next series will be full of penalties. I guarantee it. All of a sudden the Panthers will magically become a highly penalised team again.

Two goals a game over the past 7 games? That's pathetic anyway you look at it. This team gets goalied too much. It's time to move on from this core.

For those who subscribe, I quite enjoyed this Athletic article. I feel it hits very close to home, too

"This ridiculous Maple Leafs team is at the end of an era. Fans might as well enjoy it"

https://theathletic.com/4503005/2023/05/10/maple-leafs-panthers-playoffs-game-4/

McIndoe is the best. His articles really capture being a Leaf fan.

So what's everyone's confidence in a possible 4 game win streak to move on? I feel like it really isn't going to happen but there is still the smallest part of me saying, "It COULD happen!" The feeling is similar to when you buy a lottery ticket. You know you aren't going to win, but there is still that feeling that you never know.

Oh also to add to the "barely made the playoffs" Like that is something to discredit them. Who gives a flying f**k if they barely made the playoffs? Let's ask the Panthers. You could be heading to the 3rd round or you could get swept in the 2nd round but finish 2nd in the ATL. What would you choose? Ask the fans. No one cares about the regular season. Especially Leaf fans.

Pointing out that the Panthers barely squeaked into the playoffs, in large part because of the hot play of a goalie who then proved so ineffective in the playoffs that he needed to be benched, drives home that so much of what happens in the playoffs is random and hard to predict and not strictly a measure of quality.

I mean, I get it. In chaos we try to discern patterns so as to try and make sense of things but in a league with this sort of parity where so much of success boils down to a single unpredictable variable (goaltending) making grand sweeping statements like "X happened in one playoff series therefore Y" is almost always going to be wrong.

I feel like I'm reading a cut scene from Jurassic Park. I read your post in Jeff Goldblum's voice just so you know.

NHL playoffs results are random to a degree, I agree. I also have eyes and unfortunately used them to watch Game 3. When you have 3 of the top 10 highest paid players in the league on your team and all 3 of them are exceptionally inept I don't care how much randomness there is you are not winning games.

Can someone explain to me why Keefe did not break up Matthews and Marner when they were playing so horrible?

That's my issue. I'm not saying Matthews was great or anything but for me, Marner was the sole reason for that line struggling. I don't know what Marner was doing out there. He was only charged with 1 giveaway which is absurd because he gave it away all game. Keefe's reluctance to split them up might end up being his downfall.
I actually thought Matthews played well defensively but as far as offence goes, it's hard to produce when you're dragging around 1 guy.
Just one bad decision after another for 16 last night

I honestly would have benched him. Or at least given him very limited minutes. He was a nervous wreck out there. Keefe seems afraid of Matthews and Marner. After that first goal where Bunting failed to get it deep and then Matthews did his one-handed attempt they showed Keefe on the bench and it seemed he was having words with Bunting but not Matthews. Hard to tell of course, but I don't think I've ever seen Marner get a talking to after all his giveaways.

Can someone explain to me why Keefe did not break up Matthews and Marner when they were playing so horrible?

This may be heresy, but after cooling off a bit I wonder about blowing up the core entirely and changing the playstyle.  This group has been a helluva lot of fun to watch during the season, and there is a lot more time spent watching that than the playoffs.

From a purely odds-based perspective the chances of winning the Cup are so low, for any team.

So from an overall-amount-of-fun perspective, I'm tempted to let this group get one last chance together next year ... with a new coach.

Gimme a new coach, but I'm definitely not against moving one of the core 4 besides Matthews. Florida moved Huberdeau to get here.

But Tkachuk fell in their laps and let's be honest, they barely made the playoffs.

Oh also to add to the "barely made the playoffs" Like that is something to discredit them. Who gives a flying f**k if they barely made the playoffs? Let's ask the Panthers. You could be heading to the 3rd round or you could get swept in the 2nd round but finish 2nd in the ATL. What would you choose? Ask the fans. No one cares about the regular season. Especially Leaf fans.

This may be heresy, but after cooling off a bit I wonder about blowing up the core entirely and changing the playstyle.  This group has been a helluva lot of fun to watch during the season, and there is a lot more time spent watching that than the playoffs.

From a purely odds-based perspective the chances of winning the Cup are so low, for any team.

So from an overall-amount-of-fun perspective, I'm tempted to let this group get one last chance together next year ... with a new coach.

Gimme a new coach, but I'm definitely not against moving one of the core 4 besides Matthews. Florida moved Huberdeau to get here.

But Tkachuk fell in their laps and let's be honest, they barely made the playoffs.

Tkachuk did not fall into their laps. They gave up a huge amount to get him. And at the time a lot of people were saying it was a steal of a deal for the Flames. It's pretty obvious you need these type of hardnosed players to succeed in the playoffs. You look at the Oilers. They've got some major bite to them. They've got a swagger. This Leaf team always plays like it's a preseason game and they don't want to get hurt. The Leafs needed to make a big change to this core. It's something Dubas should have done after the Habs series. It was obvious then and it's been obvious since. Dubas made great deals on paper. In the regular season a lot of them looked great. Has there been one player in this playoffs that has really stoodout? I honestly can't think of one player. They've all just been so mediocre.

If I'm management I'm giving Dubas/Keefe the boot. I'm bringing in a new GM. That new GM needs to deal Marner. That new GM needs to sign Matthews now and I'm not giving Matthews a big raise. If he wants a big raise and is unwilling to sign before the season starts I'm trading him too. You can not let Matthews walk to free agency. The future isn't looking too bright in Leafland if I'm being honest.

Knowing my past leaf trauma I'm preparing for the team to win the next 3 and then lose game 7.

Nah. This team honestly would just rather not be playing. They won't be able to put in the effort to win Game 4.

So didn't see the play but what occurred after the incident? I'm assuming nothing with this crew. I say throw Simmonds in and if the game is out of hand either way lay somebody out. Always said this team has no cajones and when a rookie gets treated like that somebody should have stepped in at least said something let Bennett know that his time will come. I know the game was close so no time for a dumb penalty. I wasn't able to watch the game so I don't know the full story so maybe someone can enlighten me.

It would have been helpful if the league suspended a player for a dirty play.

Can you explain your thinking? Suppose a leaf player jumped a panther during the game. How could that have been helpful?  Are you thinking taking extra penalties is strategically effective? Are you anticipating a short-handed goal? What is the mechanism in play here?

Read my post I said the game was close so no dumb penalty to possibly cost us the game. I said at least someone should have skated over to Bennett and let him know it didn't go unnoticed. Again all I saw was the hit and to me it was dirty. No need to ram the guys head into the ice. Was it addressed in any means was my question?

I saw no reaction. The team doesn't give a shit about each other. I have a feeling it's very cliquey in the dressing room. Remember there was a game near the end of the regular season and Tavares was rocked. McCabe stood up for him. None of the usuals care. Keefe made it a big deal because they all went out for dinner together. Like I thought teams do that all the time. They're a group of good players but they aren't a team. And that's why they can't win in the playoffs.