Author Topic: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens  (Read 6060 times)

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Online bustaheims

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #225 on: June 09, 2021, 09:50:27 AM »
Quite frankly, Campbell is the only reason game 5 wasn't completely out of hand before the end of the 1st period.
That was actually game 6. Game 5 he wasn't good on goals 2 and 3.

No, it was game 5, when the Leafs could barely get a stick on the puck for most of the 1st period. I could have been a much deeper hole for the team to dig out of if Campbell didn't play well for that stretch. He kept things from getting out of hand before the Leafs actually sort of got their legs under them.
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Online bustaheims

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #226 on: June 09, 2021, 09:54:01 AM »
So Nik, busta, et al.: are you comfortable with running with Campbell next year?  Or he just the best we are likely to get?  And are you done with Freddie?

I think, next season, the Leafs need to roll with Campbell and another goalie who is in a similar situation - proven himself to be more than a full-time backup, but not really established as a a starter. I was a fan of Andersen for most of his time here, but 2 less than great seasons in a row, and he'll be 32 going into next season. I wouldn't be willing to give him a contract will any kind of term, and, unless he's willing to take a substantial pay cut to stick around for another season, I wish him the best of luck elsewhere.

Yeah I don't think anyone ever saw Campbell as an undisputed number 1 goalie. There's really only a handful of those types left in the league anyway. Most of the league is going to a platoon set-up these days. Hopefully we can snag one of those free agents or see if anyone becomes available during the expansion process. We just need to be conservative on how much cap space we allocate there.

Exactly. I'm comfortable giving Campbell the 1A role and letting him have more starts early in the season (like a 3 out of 5 type split), and go from there. Definitely not comfortable to hand him a clear #1 role, and, as you say, that's a dying breed any way.
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Offline OldTimeHockey

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #227 on: June 09, 2021, 10:28:24 AM »
So Nik, busta, et al.: are you comfortable with running with Campbell next year?  Or he just the best we are likely to get?  And are you done with Freddie?

I think, next season, the Leafs need to roll with Campbell and another goalie who is in a similar situation - proven himself to be more than a full-time backup, but not really established as a a starter. I was a fan of Andersen for most of his time here, but 2 less than great seasons in a row, and he'll be 32 going into next season. I wouldn't be willing to give him a contract will any kind of term, and, unless he's willing to take a substantial pay cut to stick around for another season, I wish him the best of luck elsewhere.

Yeah I don't think anyone ever saw Campbell as an undisputed number 1 goalie. There's really only a handful of those types left in the league anyway. Most of the league is going to a platoon set-up these days. Hopefully we can snag one of those free agents or see if anyone becomes available during the expansion process. We just need to be conservative on how much cap space we allocate there.

Exactly. I'm comfortable giving Campbell the 1A role and letting him have more starts early in the season (like a 3 out of 5 type split), and go from there. Definitely not comfortable to hand him a clear #1 role, and, as you say, that's a dying breed any way.

I don't really agree that the clear #1 role is a dying breed in that I think most teams that win a cup do it on the backs of a clear number 1. I could be mistaken on that.

Being a goalie myself, i've rightly or wrongly believed for a while that you're the most important position on the ice. Much like a quarterback in football or a pitcher in baseball. You can have the best wide receiver in the game but if you don't have anyone that can get it to him, you're sort of screwed. Sure, you can get by on an exceptional run game, but you're talking top notch running game. In baseball, you can outhit your pitching for a while but it's eventually going to catch up to you.

In the case of the Leafs series, no they did not score enough to win. That's a fact. But, when a team isn't scoring(or struggling like Matthews and Marner is) a team needs a goalie that can steal the show. Perhaps Matthews and Marner are more prone to disappearing and that's a problem in itself, but it is the hand that we've been dealt and I don't think we're easily fixing players that disappear. So, to me the solution is to find a goalie that can steal those games. Certainly that's easier said than done.

You're correct that finding someone that can come in on a 1a/1b rotation may be the best method or for that matter, the only method. But don't we already have that guy in Andersen?

Online CarltonTheBear

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #228 on: June 09, 2021, 10:37:54 AM »
You're correct that finding someone that can come in on a 1a/1b rotation may be the best method or for that matter, the only method. But don't we already have that guy in Andersen?

If he ends up getting paid more like a 1a/1b goalie (by that I mean $3-4mil) I wouldn't be completely opposed to bringing him back. Depends what else is available.

Offline OldTimeHockey

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #229 on: June 09, 2021, 10:42:18 AM »
You're correct that finding someone that can come in on a 1a/1b rotation may be the best method or for that matter, the only method. But don't we already have that guy in Andersen?

If he ends up getting paid more like a 1a/1b goalie (by that I mean $3-4mil) I wouldn't be completely opposed to bringing him back. Depends what else is available.

Personally I think he sees the writing on the wall and will be looking elsewhere. Edmonton?

Offline Guilt Trip

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #230 on: June 09, 2021, 10:43:02 AM »
If you could get Freddie back at under 4 on a 2 year you'd def have to be interested. Should be interesting after the drafts.

Offline Guilt Trip

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #231 on: June 09, 2021, 10:43:50 AM »
You're correct that finding someone that can come in on a 1a/1b rotation may be the best method or for that matter, the only method. But don't we already have that guy in Andersen?

If he ends up getting paid more like a 1a/1b goalie (by that I mean $3-4mil) I wouldn't be completely opposed to bringing him back. Depends what else is available.

Personally I think he sees the writing on the wall and will be looking elsewhere. Edmonton?
I think EDM or maybe Philly will pony up to get him.

Online bustaheims

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #232 on: June 09, 2021, 10:58:13 AM »
I don't really agree that the clear #1 role is a dying breed in that I think most teams that win a cup do it on the backs of a clear number 1. I could be mistaken on that.

3 of the last 4 Cup winning teams didn't have what we would traditionally have considered a clear #1. They mostly had the 3/5 split I was suggesting, with a guy who was the 1A who carried the load once the playoffs got going, but less so during the regular season.

The only exception in the group was Tampa last season, but they also have one of the top 3 goalies in the league, which makes them somewhat of an outlier. If you get a guy of the calibre of Vasilevskiy, you can run him out almost every game. Teams that don't have that guy have been going more and more towards a split. Of the teams left in the playoffs this season, only Tampa and Colorado didn't have a split in the 60/40 range.
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Offline Nik

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #233 on: June 09, 2021, 10:59:56 AM »
So Nik, busta, et al.: are you comfortable with running with Campbell next year?  Or he just the best we are likely to get?  And are you done with Freddie?

Well, the beautiful thing of Campbell's contract situation is he's providing such good value that having him around is a plus no matter what the situation ends up being. If there's one thing I'd hope this year taught us it's that the team really needs to be strong at the position up and down the organization because injuries happen, people play poorly at stretches, etc.

I don't think anyone would say "Campbell is the #1 next year and he'll play 70 games" right now and I think obviously you want to add another goalie who is capable of being in charge if Campbell is hurt or ineffective. More plainly you want to sign the best goalie available given the limited cap dollars the team will have provided you can still get good value.

But right now I'm absolutely comfortable giving Campbell the opportunity to come into camp and win a starting job.
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Offline Nik

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #234 on: June 09, 2021, 11:07:27 AM »
3 of the last 4 Cup winning teams didn't have what we would traditionally have considered a clear #1. They mostly had the 3/5 split I was suggesting, with a guy who was the 1A who carried the load once the playoffs got going, but less so during the regular season.

The only exception in the group was Tampa last season, but they also have one of the top 3 goalies in the league, which makes them somewhat of an outlier. If you get a guy of the calibre of Vasilevskiy, you can run him out almost every game.

That said, it may prove noteworthy that Tampa won things in a shortened season. The last team to win a cup on the back of a goalie who started 60+ games in the regular season was the Kings in 2011-2012.
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Offline Frank E

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #235 on: June 09, 2021, 11:12:58 AM »
It'd be nice if the Leafs could draft and develop a damn goalie for once.

Offline Nik

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #236 on: June 09, 2021, 11:13:11 AM »
There really is nothing like trying to educate someone on a sport that he has played for 37 years(as a goalie and then a player when knees became too bad), coached for 25(as a goalie coach for a good chunk of it), ran a hockey school for 5(continue to do so).

I'm really not sure what you're looking for here. It feels like in light of that when I said "a game" you would have known what that was. Again, I really didn't think that needed clarification. I'm not being facetious when I say that.

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #237 on: June 09, 2021, 11:32:41 AM »
That said, it may prove noteworthy that Tampa won things in a shortened season. The last team to win a cup on the back of a goalie who started 60+ games in the regular season was the Kings in 2011-2012.

Yup. In the cap era, there's actually only been a 3 teams (by my count) that won the Cup with a goalie that started 60+ games in the regular season. There's a number that were in the mid to high 50s, but, the league is definitely trending towards a much more balanced split. Between 67/33 and 50/50 seems to be where teams want to be now.
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Offline Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #238 on: June 09, 2021, 01:35:50 PM »
If you can get Andersen back at a lower cost (probably unlikely) wouldn't he be rather easily the best option available to run i this split system?

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Re: Round 1: Toronto Maple Leafs vs. Montreal Canadiens
« Reply #239 on: June 09, 2021, 02:35:08 PM »
If you can get Andersen back at a lower cost (probably unlikely) wouldn't he be rather easily the best option available to run i this split system?

His recent track record says no.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan