Leafs part ways with Berube
- Thread starter CarltonTheBear
- Start date
dappleganger
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Arn
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He sounds awesome.
But I think the bit at the end is the key - why would he risk what he has for where the Leafs are now. I think they're a tricky sell for the likes of him. Unfortunately. Cos I'd like to see someone who comes from a bit of "out of the box" thinking with fresh ideas etc
But I think the bit at the end is the key - why would he risk what he has for where the Leafs are now. I think they're a tricky sell for the likes of him. Unfortunately. Cos I'd like to see someone who comes from a bit of "out of the box" thinking with fresh ideas etc
Yeah I just don't see Carle happening. Chicago went after him hard just last year and despite that seemingly being a perfect fit with Bedard & co. he still turned them down.
dappleganger
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Chicago still seems directionless so I'm not surprised he may have passed on them.
ZBBM
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Fantastic article. A must-read.
herman
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Fassthole hockey
I think maybe this is where you can pitch him that he's here for the long haul. Try to be competitive next year, if not we pivot hard to turning over the roster and pushing for younger talent. Give him a five year deal and be patient.
L K
Well-known member
You could give him a long term commitment but honestly that means nothing if the GM fears for their job or the board demands a blood sacrifice.
I would assume that any promises to Carle would be that the team is going to move in his direction (as in Chayka's on the same page) whether that is with Matthews at the helm or in a more conventional rebuild.
The appeal is always going to be money and the prestige of coaching the Leafs. It's either enough to entice him or it isn't.
I just hope whoever gets the job runs a play style that is worth watching. I can take losing. Hell we can finish dead last next year for all I care. As long as the team looks entertaining in defeat I can live with it. I can't take another season of being perpetually out chanced as a feature.
I would assume that any promises to Carle would be that the team is going to move in his direction (as in Chayka's on the same page) whether that is with Matthews at the helm or in a more conventional rebuild.
The appeal is always going to be money and the prestige of coaching the Leafs. It's either enough to entice him or it isn't.
I just hope whoever gets the job runs a play style that is worth watching. I can take losing. Hell we can finish dead last next year for all I care. As long as the team looks entertaining in defeat I can live with it. I can't take another season of being perpetually out chanced as a feature.
Scotty Bowman won 9 Cups as a coach but it wasn't all due to his coaching. Scotty carefully reviewed the team he was going to.
He messed up with Buffalo but made the right call elsewhere.
Carle has the same luxury. He didn't get to where he is by being stupid. Ditto for Cassidy and other top coaches.
Toronto will not be high on any top coach's list having done such a review.
Their 28th place team is aged with a shallow prospect system and their chronically injured top star making rumblings of moving on while their other top enigma made up his mind that he wasn't going to play Berube hockey.
Chayka & Sundin will be quickly realigned to giving some up and coming younger coach or a fading older coach a chance.
By July 2027, Matthews will probably make the GM decision they're afraid to make now for them.
He messed up with Buffalo but made the right call elsewhere.
Carle has the same luxury. He didn't get to where he is by being stupid. Ditto for Cassidy and other top coaches.
Toronto will not be high on any top coach's list having done such a review.
Their 28th place team is aged with a shallow prospect system and their chronically injured top star making rumblings of moving on while their other top enigma made up his mind that he wasn't going to play Berube hockey.
Chayka & Sundin will be quickly realigned to giving some up and coming younger coach or a fading older coach a chance.
By July 2027, Matthews will probably make the GM decision they're afraid to make now for them.
Yeah that's the thing, other than guaranteed money even a long-term contract would be meaningless. Everyone knows how cut throat the league can be with coaches. Carle is presumably very well compensated and comfortable in Denver. He's got 3 young kids, he's only 36 years old. I wouldn't be shocked if stayed where he was for a number of more years.
Also I have nothing to really base this off but I do figure if/when he jumps into the NHL it'll be in a situation that might be a little easier on his young family (i.e. maybe not the massive media storm that is Toronto, but also likely an American team).
herman
Well-known member
That's why it's important to monitor and manage screen time.
Also, some American teams would be worse. And education up here comes with significantly less (flying) lead poisoning, if that's a concern.
More on topic: I do think Toronto is a good fit even if the promises of a long term might not actually be functionally guaranteed if Chayka/Sundin get cleaned out. Toronto is very, very slow to remove coaches, arguably way too slow, but it would work to advantage in this case.
It really looks like Chayka is looking for a coaching partner, in a similar vein to Dubas/Keefe, MacFarland/Bednar where the coach is essentially another front office executive that helps build out and implement the team identity; they already have a natural fit in the broad strokes of how they want a hockey team to play.
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mr grieves
Well-known member
That's the thing, I think realistically Chayka and Sundin want to build a proper program and you have to start with the understanding that the coach, provided they click with the org, is around for the long haul. I think everyone knows that Scotty Bowman couldn't get this group of players to win a Cup so the focus is absolutely on the players and GM short term moves to see if they can salvage another year of Matthews' career but I think most know that pivoting to a rebuild will be inevitable. In that sense I don't really see a reason why David Carle would have to worry about job security.
Year 1: Hope for a turn around
Year 2: Make a decision on Matthews
Year 3: Probability is you start fresh
To me Carle gets at least 2yrs free, and if the GM is rebuilding and preaches patience I can see a world where he's here for 5yrs almost by default. But yes, I do agree that it isn't the most enticing situation to be in, but I think that's why you throw money and term and explain the actual vision going forward.
Chances to win is a big appeal too. Or the coach quickly fades onto the scrap heap of coaches who fell short.
The chances of Carle being able to win a Cup any time soon with this group are pretty small. Why would he come to Toronto over other situations clear of the Canadian tax code?
I'd prefer a rebuild. But they're not going to do that willingly. They want dangle hope to Matthews and get their playoff revenue.
Finding "a play style that is worth watching" is something I think that this current roster is capable of - playing better than what they attempted this past season with the talent they already have. Short term, Chayka could look clever and get them back into the playoffs. He still has a challenge in that the UFA market is going to be limited again and I'm reading the over/under on McMann's UFA deal, for example, is $6 mil !!! (good for him of course) - prices are going to be nuts with the large rise in the cap.
I think Rielly, who is still skating well, could be revived under "a play style that is worth watching" and his price tag of $7.5 mil isn't that bad compared to the UFA prices to come. The bidding on Raddysh will far exceed that. They need a right handed puck mover.
They have to flip one of Woll, Stolarz or Hildeby or lose one of them on waivers. They could get a 3/4 center back.
Then they could use the balance of the remaining cap space to boost the forwards defensive ability/two way play and depth.
Some others here, including yourself, probably have some better ideas.
That gives them a decent shot at the playoffs - far from guaranteed with the improvement in other teams in the East. But I think it will be more entertaining to watch ... until the déjà vu in the playoffs.