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2025-26 Toronto Maple Leafs General Discussion

Who would do the exit interviews? In my head, I thought management would check in with each player to discuss each player's specific scenario. We have no management (or capable coach).
 
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Arn said:
I wasn’t sure which way the tie breakers fell.

That Rangers game was a real sickener. Basically a 4 point swing there.
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Regulation wins would be the first tie-breaker, Flames and Rangers have us beat there.

I'm comfortable at 5, but if the lottery doesn't go our way and we lose the pick yeah that extra point will keep me up at night for awhile.
 
Yeah I don’t mind where in the top 5 we end up, as long as it’s the top 5.

Equally I feel like we don’t “deserve” to have a top 5 pick cos we were so crap at being crap enough to get it.
 
Bender said:
I'm sorry but both things can be true. None of them got close to McDavid or Draisaitl in terms of playoff production. The Oilers had Stu freaking Skinner as their goalie and went to two cup finals. I'm sorry but we all know how much water you carry for these guys. Not one of them, one time, took the team on their backs and carried the team forward. I agree goaltending has been an Achilles heel and management deserves blame but to say the core 4 don't have much blame in this truly has me at a loss for words to describe how selective that analysis is.
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There are only 2 players in NHL history with 50 or more playoff games that have a higher playoff ppg than McDavid or Draisaitl. You might have heard of them: Gretzky & Lemieux. That is quite a yardstick you have there. And they couldn't beat the Florida Panthers either.

The first time I recall the term shadow in hockey was against Bobby Hull. 15 years, mostly in a 6 team league and on a good team with a number of Hall of Famers. When they won their one and only cup, Makita led in goal scoring and Pilote in points. One of the greatest of his era arguably never "put his team entirely on his back" to a Cup - to win 2 rounds - though he had great playoff stats.

Jon Cooper remarked about the Leafs (paraphrased) "you put your best players on their core 4 to negate them and then let our bottom 6 beat their inferior bottom 6". He applied that against most opponents because he felt he had the best 3rd line in hockey (very roughly stated)

About 1/3 of Conn Smythe winners are goalies. Very difficult to get very far in the playoffs without a good goalie. Stats are probably not the best reference there as Vasilevskiy and Hellebuyck have the worst playoff GAA since 2022-23 among goalies who played 8+ playoff games.
 
cw said:
There are only 2 players in NHL history with 50 or more playoff games that have a higher playoff ppg than McDavid or Draisaitl. You might have heard of them: Gretzky & Lemieux. That is quite a yardstick you have there. And they couldn't beat the Florida Panthers either.

The first time I recall the term shadow in hockey was against Bobby Hull. 15 years, mostly in a 6 team league and on a good team with a number of Hall of Famers. When they won their one and only cup, Makita led in goal scoring and Pilote in points. One of the greatest of his era arguably never "put his team entirely on his back" to a Cup - to win 2 rounds - though he had great playoff stats.

Jon Cooper remarked about the Leafs (paraphrased) "you put your best players on their core 4 to negate them and then let our bottom 6 beat their inferior bottom 6". He applied that against most opponents because he felt he had the best 3rd line in hockey (very roughly stated)

About 1/3 of Conn Smythe winners are goalies. Very difficult to get very far in the playoffs without a good goalie. Stats are probably not the best reference there as Vasilevskiy and Hellebuyck have the worst playoff GAA since 2022-23 among goalies who played 8+ playoff games.
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The issue isn't the Florida Panthers over the last 10 years and you know that. The point I'm making is not one of these players carried the team on their back throughout 10 years to win a round or two, and I think the point still stands. It's one thing to get to the finals and a whole other thing to win two rounds in 10 years. You'd think with that much talent to go around someone would rise up like Mikita, but nobody did.

If we want to move off of the Oilers then we can go Colorado who had mediocre goaltending when they won with Kuemper sporting a .902. Also we are completely glossing over the fact that Freddy had some excellent playoff numbers in at least two of the four playoff runs he had here at .922 and .936. Even Campbell had a .934. They couldn't win a round with those numbers?

And as mentioned before, the Core 4 are the highest paid players. It's a roster construction issue when you don't have enough money left over to pay for decent goaltenders and bottom six players etc - I agree with you there, and they should've moved off one of them to better balance the lineup. But the point still stands, and you're consistently white washing it. None of the core 4 ever lived up to their playoff performances compared to their regular season success basically ever even in terms of raw point totals, to a point where they won as many rounds as the Leafs of the much derided 1980s. If you want to say that's all goaltending's fault, be my guest, but it's just not reality when you win two rounds in 10 years and I refuse to accept this revisionist history that it all came down to goaltending.
 
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bustaheims said:
The problem is expecting the new GM and/or POHO to make one of their first moves firing him (because anyone competent is firing him). Take that burden away from prospective hires. Don't make their first major move be a negative one.
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They are big boys and if you fire him now, you are taking that choice away from the new guy.
 
bustaheims said:
The problem is expecting the new GM and/or POHO to make one of their first moves firing him (because anyone competent is firing him). Take that burden away from prospective hires. Don't make their first major move be a negative one.
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I think for me it's about doings things in the proper order and having the right person making the decision. Pelley hires the President, President hires a GM, GM hires a coach. It also goes that way for firings. I don't think Pelley should ever really get a say in who the coach of the team is (even if he happens to be right), and that's who would really be making that decision if he was fired before a permanent GM is in place.
 
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