Author Topic: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590  (Read 6928 times)

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Offline bustaheims

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #345 on: April 24, 2018, 12:49:27 PM »
Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.
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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #345 on: April 24, 2018, 12:49:27 PM »

Offline Significantly Insignificant

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #346 on: April 24, 2018, 12:52:51 PM »
Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I wonder if Nathan Horton and Joffrey Lupul ever get included in numbers like that by mistake.
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Offline Andy

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #347 on: April 24, 2018, 01:45:36 PM »
Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I think the main difference, though, is that a lot of the Boston players with experience are also pretty valuable players. Krejci, Marchand, Bergeron, Backes, Nash, Rask, Krug and Chara beats JVR, Marleau, Plekanec, Andersen, Hainsey and Polak pretty soundly, imo.



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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #348 on: April 24, 2018, 04:15:20 PM »
Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I think the main difference, though, is that a lot of the Boston players with experience are also pretty valuable players. Krejci, Marchand, Bergeron, Backes, Nash, Rask, Krug and Chara beats JVR, Marleau, Plekanec, Andersen, Hainsey and Polak pretty soundly, imo.

We'll find out tomorrow night! :)

Offline Bender

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #349 on: April 24, 2018, 04:21:43 PM »
Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I think the main difference, though, is that a lot of the Boston players with experience are also pretty valuable players. Krejci, Marchand, Bergeron, Backes, Nash, Rask, Krug and Chara beats JVR, Marleau, Plekanec, Andersen, Hainsey and Polak pretty soundly, imo.

Krejci, Backes, Nash, Krug have done barely anything this whole series. The B's whole series literally (actually figuratively, but who cares!) rests on the top line. You shut them down and they shouldn't be able to match Toronto's depth on paper, regardless of experience.
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Offline Andy

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #350 on: April 24, 2018, 04:34:00 PM »
Leafs have Hainsey who has a cup, outside of that the only players on the Leafs who have won a playoff round are Marleau, Plekanec and Polak.

JVR has been to a stanley Cup final with Philiadelphia. It was awhile ago.

Last night was Andersen's 40th playoff game, and he took Anaheim all the way to Game 7 of the Conference Finals one year (the only team to take Chicago to 7 games in those playoffs).

According to ESPN, Boston's roster had 917 playoff games total while the Leafs roster had 663 games. However, that's counting Brian Gionta's 112 games and he hasn't and won't play in this series. So the edge isn't massive. A lot of the guys from Boston's Cup runs are gone (except of course much of the core), and Boston is also relying on a lot of young/inexperienced players.

Not that they're playing much, but we can add Martin and Moore to the list of players who have been on teams that have won an NHL playoff series.

I think the main difference, though, is that a lot of the Boston players with experience are also pretty valuable players. Krejci, Marchand, Bergeron, Backes, Nash, Rask, Krug and Chara beats JVR, Marleau, Plekanec, Andersen, Hainsey and Polak pretty soundly, imo.

Krejci, Backes, Nash, Krug have done barely anything this whole series. The B's whole series literally (actually figuratively, but who cares!) rests on the top line. You shut them down and they shouldn't be able to match Toronto's depth on paper, regardless of experience.

I don't neccesarily disagree with any of that (although Krug has 7 or 8 points this series I think), I was just pointing out the differences in the calibre of experienced players in context of the debate as to which team has more experience.

That Bergeron line has brutalized Toronto though and could have scored about a half dozen goals yesterday. The only thing shutting that line down is/has been Andersen. I think Matthews needs a little more help on his wings..


Offline herman

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #351 on: April 24, 2018, 04:39:27 PM »
Krejci, Backes, Nash, Krug have done barely anything this whole series. The B's whole series literally (actually figuratively, but who cares!) rests on the top line. You shut them down and they shouldn't be able to match Toronto's depth on paper, regardless of experience.

A strong possession driving line does not necessarily need to score on their own, but through the course of their play, they can force repeated icings, bad matchups, and tired lines that usually result in a higher chance for either scoring or drawing a penalty. The Bruins' depth lines do a good job setting the table for Bergeron's line.

In this game, Cassidy elected to keep sending out Bergeon and Krejci's lines because they were in a faceoff winning groove and kept hemming the Leafs in their own zone. If it wasn't for Andersen and some lucky blocks, they could have taken the series then and there.

Offline hockeyfan1

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #352 on: April 24, 2018, 06:24:48 PM »
Boston's management are the best. They get so pissed off.. I'm waiting for their heads to explode.

You gotta love Cam Neely.  That shot of him, his head looks like an overinflated football that some evil being just keeps pumping air into.  At least that's a realistic human reaction.  Lou looks someone just stunned him with a 2x4.


LOL

Offline herman

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #353 on: April 24, 2018, 06:37:16 PM »

Leg day, every day.

Offline Heroic Shrimp

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #354 on: April 24, 2018, 10:49:40 PM »

Leg day, every day.

While on the surface it looks like Mitch just hoists him back, Marner definitely trips him by "accidentally" pulling his stick forward into the back of the guy's skate.
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Offline herman

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #355 on: April 25, 2018, 06:27:09 AM »

Leg day, every day.

While on the surface it looks like Mitch just hoists him back, Marner definitely trips him by "accidentally" pulling his stick forward into the back of the guy's skate.

Hard to tell in motion, but it looks to me like the starting point of Marner’s stick is in front of Krug’s skate, which would make tripping him not very likely.

Offline Heroic Shrimp

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #356 on: April 25, 2018, 08:09:03 AM »

Leg day, every day.

While on the surface it looks like Mitch just hoists him back, Marner definitely trips him by "accidentally" pulling his stick forward into the back of the guy's skate.

Hard to tell in motion, but it looks to me like the starting point of Marner’s stick is in front of Krug’s skate, which would make tripping him not very likely.

The camera cuts up at exactly the wrong moment, but it still strikes me that Marner's stick is between Krug's legs, and as he pulls it forward, he just happens to turn the blade behind Krug's right heel.  It certainly adds up when you look at how hard and fast Krug goes down.
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Offline sickbeast

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #357 on: April 25, 2018, 09:00:38 AM »

Leg day, every day.

While on the surface it looks like Mitch just hoists him back, Marner definitely trips him by "accidentally" pulling his stick forward into the back of the guy's skate.

Hard to tell in motion, but it looks to me like the starting point of Marner’s stick is in front of Krug’s skate, which would make tripping him not very likely.

The camera cuts up at exactly the wrong moment, but it still strikes me that Marner's stick is between Krug's legs, and as he pulls it forward, he just happens to turn the blade behind Krug's right heel.  It certainly adds up when you look at how hard and fast Krug goes down.
Actually comparing Marner to a heroic shrimp on that play would be a good analogy. So I will trust your judgment on that.

Offline herman

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #358 on: April 25, 2018, 09:38:21 AM »

The camera cuts up at exactly the wrong moment, but it still strikes me that Marner's stick is between Krug's legs, and as he pulls it forward, he just happens to turn the blade behind Krug's right heel.  It certainly adds up when you look at how hard and fast Krug goes down.

If you don't mind, I will take this as an invitation to continue presenting formal arguments for this play.

Ladies and gentlemen of the forums, at Mr. Shrimp's prompting and out of respect for his keen eye, I have delved deeper into this video capturing the moment when Mr. Mitch Marner was waylaid from behind by Mr. Torey Krug, in which an ensuing scuffle resulted in Mr. Krug thrown to the ice.

Mr. Shrimp contends that while it appears that Mr. Marner hoisted Mr. Krug into the air by the strength of his lower body, he surmises that Mr. Marner aided Mr. Krug's fall by way using his stick behind the skate of Mr. Krug to lever him to the ice.

In my quest to uncover the truth of the matter, I have discovered that Mr. Shrimp is actually correct! [pause for gasps] There was indeed a trip! However, [pause for effect], it was not a trip by way of Mr. Marner's stick!

Exhibit A: At the beginning of the video clip referenced above, as I presented earlier, Mr. Marner's stick is held against the ice in front of Mr. Krug's right skate. As all know from basic kinematics, if a stick was used to trip a player, the direction of motion of the fall would be in the direction of the falling player's centre of gravity traversing over the point of contact with the stick. In layterms, a stick in front of a player's skate would yield a fall forward, while a stick behind the skate would yield a fall backwards. As evidenced by the video, Mr. Krug falls back and to the left.

Exhibit B: Note Mr. Krug's body position at the intiation of his fall. His right leg, ostensibly the one that would be tripped by Mr. Marner's stick, remains on the ice, while his left leg is the first indication that he has lost balance, leading to his fall back and to the left.

Exhibit C: Mr. Marner's moment of force is directed in a single direction: upwards. Mr. Krug had heretofore been draped across Mr. Marner's shoulders, right hand braced upon the back of Mr. Marner's head, but the bulk of his centre of gravity is outside of Mr. Marner's body column. Mr. Marner's movement should not have been able to throw Mr. Krug to the ice if it was a hoisting as I had first surmised.

So what truly caused Mr. Krug's fall?

Ladies and gentlemen of the forum, I refer you back to Exhibit B: Mr. Krug's left leg. At the beginning of the video, Mr. Krug's left leg is not astride Mr. Marner as I had first presumed, but rather his left hip is planted against Mr. Marner's right hip. The moment of force Mr. Marner generates does not lift Mr. Krug's centre of mass, but rather displaces Mr. Krug's left leg up, and the hinging of the hip and the leg continuing to travel above its normal plane of motion levers Mr. Krug's centre of gravity behind his remaining base of balance. Thus, Mr. Krug is thrown to the ice back and to the left.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 09:44:46 AM by herman »

Offline Heroic Shrimp

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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #359 on: April 25, 2018, 11:33:02 AM »

The camera cuts up at exactly the wrong moment, but it still strikes me that Marner's stick is between Krug's legs, and as he pulls it forward, he just happens to turn the blade behind Krug's right heel.  It certainly adds up when you look at how hard and fast Krug goes down.

If you don't mind, I will take this as an invitation to continue presenting formal arguments for this play.

Ladies and gentlemen of the forums, at Mr. Shrimp's prompting and out of respect for his keen eye, I have delved deeper into this video capturing the moment when Mr. Mitch Marner was waylaid from behind by Mr. Torey Krug, in which an ensuing scuffle resulted in Mr. Krug thrown to the ice.

Mr. Shrimp contends that while it appears that Mr. Marner hoisted Mr. Krug into the air by the strength of his lower body, he surmises that Mr. Marner aided Mr. Krug's fall by way using his stick behind the skate of Mr. Krug to lever him to the ice.

In my quest to uncover the truth of the matter, I have discovered that Mr. Shrimp is actually correct! [pause for gasps] There was indeed a trip! However, [pause for effect], it was not a trip by way of Mr. Marner's stick!

Exhibit A: At the beginning of the video clip referenced above, as I presented earlier, Mr. Marner's stick is held against the ice in front of Mr. Krug's right skate. As all know from basic kinematics, if a stick was used to trip a player, the direction of motion of the fall would be in the direction of the falling player's centre of gravity traversing over the point of contact with the stick. In layterms, a stick in front of a player's skate would yield a fall forward, while a stick behind the skate would yield a fall backwards. As evidenced by the video, Mr. Krug falls back and to the left.

Exhibit B: Note Mr. Krug's body position at the intiation of his fall. His right leg, ostensibly the one that would be tripped by Mr. Marner's stick, remains on the ice, while his left leg is the first indication that he has lost balance, leading to his fall back and to the left.

Exhibit C: Mr. Marner's moment of force is directed in a single direction: upwards. Mr. Krug had heretofore been draped across Mr. Marner's shoulders, right hand braced upon the back of Mr. Marner's head, but the bulk of his centre of gravity is outside of Mr. Marner's body column. Mr. Marner's movement should not have been able to throw Mr. Krug to the ice if it was a hoisting as I had first surmised.

So what truly caused Mr. Krug's fall?

Ladies and gentlemen of the forum, I refer you back to Exhibit B: Mr. Krug's left leg. At the beginning of the video, Mr. Krug's left leg is not astride Mr. Marner as I had first presumed, but rather his left hip is planted against Mr. Marner's right hip. The moment of force Mr. Marner generates does not lift Mr. Krug's centre of mass, but rather displaces Mr. Krug's left leg up, and the hinging of the hip and the leg continuing to travel above its normal plane of motion levers Mr. Krug's centre of gravity behind his remaining base of balance. Thus, Mr. Krug is thrown to the ice back and to the left.

You're right that it's not Marner's stick!  Fuller video angle here at around 0:06.  Looks a little slew-footy, but you're likely right that it's more Marner's upper leg that is pushing up on Krug's left leg/hip.  Either way, totally accidental and also totally intentional.
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Re: Bruins @ Leafs - Apr. 23rd, 7:00pm - CBC, Fan 590
« Reply #359 on: April 25, 2018, 11:33:02 AM »