Ranking Prospects Post-Matthews

[herman]

PPP's Top 25 Under 25 for 2016-2017 is under way.
http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/toronto-maple-leafs-top-25-prospects-under-25/2016/7/10/12136480/the-t25u25-is-in-production

How would you rank them? Do you rank by ceiling/potential? or current NHL usefulness? How would you rank our big 4? Who rounds out the top 5? Has the pool ever been this tightly contested in each of the talent tiers?

2016 Eligible:		2016's list		2015's list
Adam Brooks Andreas Johnson Andrew Nielsen Antoine Bibeau Auston Matthews Brendan Leipsic Carl Grundstrom Connor Brown Connor Carrick Dakota Joshua Dmytro Timashov Dominic Toninato Frank Corrado Frederik Gauthier Garret Sparks Jack Walker JD Greenway Jeremy Bracco Jesper Lindgren JJ Piccinich Joseph Woll Josh Leivo Justin Holl Kasmir Kaskisuo Kasperi Kapanen Keaton Middleton Kerby Rychel Martin Marincin Martins Dzierkals Mitch Marner Morgan Rielly Nicolas Mattinen Nikita Korostelev Nikita Soshnikov Nikita Zaitsev Nikolai Chebykin Nolan Vesey Pierre Engvall Rinat Valiev Stephen Desrocher Tobias Lindberg Travis Dermott Viktor Loov Vladimir Boblyev William Nylander Yegor Korshkov Zach Hyman		25. Yegor Korshkov 24. Martins Dzierkals 23. Carl Grundstrom 22. Andrew Neilsen 21. Rinat Valiev 20. Tobias Lindberg 19. Travis Dermott 18. Josh Leivo 17. Brendan Leipsic 16. Jeremy Bracco 15. Zach Hyman 14. Frank Corrado 13. Dmytro Timashov 12. Andreas Johnson 11. Kerby Rychel 10. Nikita Soshnikov 9. Kasperi Kapanen 8. Martin Marincin 7. Connor Carrick 6. Nikita Zaitsev 5. Connor Brown 4. Morgan Rielly 3. Mitch Marner 2. William Nylander 1. Auston Matthews (duh)		25. Christopher Gibson - traded 24. Matt Finn - traded 23. Scott Harrington - traded 22. Travis Dermott 21. Dmytro Timashov 20. Carter Verhaeghe - traded 19. Frederik Gauthier 18. Nikita Soshnikov 17. Taylor Beck - traded 16. Viktor Lööv 15. Josh Leivo 14. Jeremy Bracco 13. Stuart Percy - UFA'd 12. Brendan Leipsic 11. Andreas Johnson 10. Martin Marincin 9. Richard Panik - traded 8. Connor Brown 7. Peter Holland - graduated 6. Kasperi Kapanen 5. Mitch Marner 4. Nazem Kadri - graduated 3. Jake Gardiner - graduated 2. William Nylander 1. Morgan Rielly

TLN is doing a top 20 (Calder-eligible) prospects as well, so I'll track both here.

20. Garret Sparks 19. Kasmir Kaskisuo 18. Adam Brooks 17. Yegor Korshkov 16. Tobias Lindberg 15. Andrew Neilsen 14. Carl Grundstrom 13. Zach Hyman 12. Brendan Leipsic 11. Jeremy Bracco 10. Nikita Soshnikov 9. Travis Dermott 8. Dmytro Timashov 7. Andreas Johnson 6. Connor Brown 5. Kasperi Kapanen 4. Nikita Zaitsev 3. William Nylander 2. Mitch Marner 1. Auston Matthews

[Coco-puffs]

Sure, I'll take a stab.

1. Auston Matthews
Mitch Marner
Morgan Rielly
William Nylander
5. Nikita Zaitsev
Connor Brown
Kasperi Kapanen
Connor Carrick
Zach Hyman
10. Nikita Soshnikov
Jeremy Bracco
Kerby Rychel
Travis Dermott
Dmytro Timashov
15. Martin Marincin
Andreas Johnson
Frank Corrado
Yegor Korshkov
Carl Grundstrom
20. Brendan Leipsic
Josh Leivo
Andrew Nielsen
Martins Dzierkals
Rinat Valiev
Frederik Gauthier

I combined NHL potential and NHL readiness in my ranking- I tried not to value one over the other. 

Gauthier had to make the list IMO because he's going to play in the NHL as a 4th line center, face-off specialist, and PK forward.  Probably in 2017-2018.  In the next group were a bunch of goalies, Brooks, and Greenway.

[TBLeafer]

My list is a little different.  I have a slightly different definition of what qualifies as a prospect.  To me a prospect is one that has yet to crack an NHL roster.

A U 25 roster player is a U 25 roster player, not a prospect, so in my prospect pool, Morgan Rielly for instance, doesn't qualify.  He's a core player, signed long term.  That being said, here are my top 20 prospects:

Ranked on both NHL readiness and long term success.

1. Auston Matthews
2. Mitch Marner
3. William Nylander
4. Nikita Zaitsev
5. Connor Carrick
6. Connor Brown
7. Zach Hyman
8. Nikita Soshnikov
9. Kerby Rychel
10. Kasperi Kapanen
11. Travis Dermott
12. Jeremy Bracco
13. Viktor Loov
14. Tobias Lindberg
15. Brendan Leipsic
16. Antoine Bibeau
17. Andrew Nielsen
18. Frederik Gauthier
19. Josh Leivo
20. Garret Sparks

Not qualified in my list are the likes of Corrado, Rielly, Marincin, etc. as they have already both played their rookie season and aren't currently in the minors.

[Bender]

My list is a little different.  I have a slightly different definition of what qualifies as a prospect.  To me a prospect is one that has yet to crack an NHL roster.

A U 25 roster player is a U 25 roster player, not a prospect, so in my prospect pool, Morgan Rielly for instance, doesn't qualify.  He's a core player, signed long term.  That being said, here are my top 20 prospects:

Ranked on both NHL readiness and long term success.

1. Auston Matthews
2. Mitch Marner
3. William Nylander
4. Nikita Zaitsev
5. Connor Carrick
6. Connor Brown
7. Zach Hyman
8. Nikita Soshnikov
9. Kerby Rychel
10. Kasperi Kapanen
11. Travis Dermott
12. Jeremy Bracco
13. Viktor Loov
14. Tobias Lindberg
15. Brendan Leipsic
16. Antoine Bibeau
17. Andrew Nielsen
18. Frederik Gauthier
19. Josh Leivo
20. Garret Sparks

Not qualified in my list are the likes of Corrado, Rielly, Marincin, etc. as they have already both played their rookie season and aren't currently in the minors.

Yeah but the PPP article isn't about whether they've played in the NHL or not. It literally is what is says: Players U25 are eligible for the list.

[TBLeafer]

My list is a little different.  I have a slightly different definition of what qualifies as a prospect.  To me a prospect is one that has yet to crack an NHL roster.

A U 25 roster player is a U 25 roster player, not a prospect, so in my prospect pool, Morgan Rielly for instance, doesn't qualify.  He's a core player, signed long term.  That being said, here are my top 20 prospects:

Ranked on both NHL readiness and long term success.

1. Auston Matthews
2. Mitch Marner
3. William Nylander
4. Nikita Zaitsev
5. Connor Carrick
6. Connor Brown
7. Zach Hyman
8. Nikita Soshnikov
9. Kerby Rychel
10. Kasperi Kapanen
11. Travis Dermott
12. Jeremy Bracco
13. Viktor Loov
14. Tobias Lindberg
15. Brendan Leipsic
16. Antoine Bibeau
17. Andrew Nielsen
18. Frederik Gauthier
19. Josh Leivo
20. Garret Sparks

Not qualified in my list are the likes of Corrado, Rielly, Marincin, etc. as they have already both played their rookie season and aren't currently in the minors.

Yeah but the PPP article isn't about whether they've played in the NHL or not. It literally is what is says: Players U25 are eligible for the list.

Understood, but I'm not going off the PPP article.  Plus it isn't hard to see who I'm omitting.  Top young talent is different than prospect rankings wouldn't you say?  It makes no sense to me to rank Rielly as a prospect is all.

[Arn]

You do love to be contrary 

[TBLeafer]

You do love to be contrary 

LOL! 

[Nik]

I'm going to be ranking them based on whose name, if they were characters in a novel you bought at the airport, would make you question the author's judgment the most:

1. Kerby Rychel
2. Auston Matthews
3. Jack Walker
4. Yegor Korshkov
5. Antoine Bibeau
6. Garret Sparks
7. Carl Grundstrom
8. Morgan Rielly
9. Viktor Loov
10. Connor Carrick

[bustaheims]

I'm going to be ranking them based on whose name, if they were characters in a novel you bought at the airport, would make you question the author's judgment the most:

1. Kerby Rychel
2. Auston Matthews
3. Jack Walker
4. Yegor Korshkov
5. Antoine Bibeau
6. Garret Sparks
7. Carl Grundstrom
8. Morgan Rielly
9. Viktor Loov
10. Connor Carrick

This list is invalid without Dakota Joshua as the #1.

[Frank E]

I'm going to be ranking them based on whose name, if they were characters in a novel you bought at the airport, would make you question the author's judgment the most:

1. Kerby Rychel
2. Auston Matthews
3. Jack Walker
4. Yegor Korshkov
5. Antoine Bibeau
6. Garret Sparks
7. Carl Grundstrom
8. Morgan Rielly
9. Viktor Loov
10. Connor Carrick

This list is invalid without Dakota Joshua as the #1.

The omission of a guy named Vladimir Bobylev was enough for me to throw it away.

Garbage List.

[Nik]

5 worst omissions from my Airport Novel list:

1. Dakota Joshua
2. Rinat Valiev
3. JD Greenway
4. Nikita Korostelev
5. Keaton Middleton

[RedLeaf]

My list is a little different.  I have a slightly different definition of what qualifies as a prospect.  To me a prospect is one that has yet to crack an NHL roster.

A U 25 roster player is a U 25 roster player, not a prospect, so in my prospect pool, Morgan Rielly for instance, doesn't qualify.  He's a core player, signed long term.  That being said, here are my top 20 prospects:

Ranked on both NHL readiness and long term success.

1. Mitch Marner
2. Auston Matthews
3. William Nylander
4. Nikita Zaitsev
5. Connor Carrick
6. Connor Brown
7. Zach Hyman
8. Nikita Soshnikov
9. Kerby Rychel
10. Kasperi Kapanen
11. Travis Dermott
12. Jeremy Bracco
13. Viktor Loov
14. Tobias Lindberg
15. Brendan Leipsic
16. Antoine Bibeau
17. Andrew Nielsen
18. Frederik Gauthier
19. Josh Leivo
20. Garret Sparks

Not qualified in my list are the likes of Corrado, Rielly, Marincin, etc. as they have already both played their rookie season and aren't currently in the minors.

I made ONE change to your list. I don't know if I believe it. At least not yet. I just don't think we should all assume we have the number one and two in the correct order. I'd like to at least see them both play in an exhibition game first before I'm completely comfortable putting them in order. Anyone else think there's a chance?

[Nik]

Technically, Rychel, Leivo and Carrick aren't rookies either as none would be eligible for the Calder next year.

[pmrules]

It is a haul of picks, and it is too early to say it would have been the wrong decision, even now in hindsight.

 If I'm understanding correctly, I guess I was just under the impression that Hunter was drafting Marner at that spot as a first priority and plan. If the link it to be believed, they didn't think enough of him to prefer giving up that spot and trading down. That surprised me.

Me too but, to give the organization credit, I think there's real value in exploring all of your options. That very well might have been a "they'll never give us all that, will they?" sort of offer.

If the Leafs think Columbus' rookie GM wants Hanafin, they make the offer to see if they'll bite.  It was the Leafs trying to take advantage here, not so much them not liking Marner.

They seemed to like Werenski enough to keep their stash.

So, I agree.

Just saw this conversation for the first time as this thread was brought back up the last day or so. 

My understanding was that the leafs put this in front of Columbus just in case Marner was taken at 3 and that Hanifin was available for Columbus at 4.  They were only interested in executing their trade down strategy if Marner was off the table.

Which is interesting because, if memory serves correct,  Nonis was considering a trade down deal with St. Louis for their 1st and their 2  2nds when the Nylander pick came up, but Shanahan over turned him. 

[TBLeafer]

I made ONE change to your list. I don't know if I believe it. At least not yet. I just don't think we should all assume we have the number one and two in the correct order. I'd like to at least see them both play in an exhibition game first before I'm completely comfortable putting them in order. Anyone else think there's a chance?

Hey, to each his own, Marner has crazy skill but I give Matthews the edge due to 1C NHL potential.  We are very lucky to have them BOTH!

Technically, Rychel, Leivo and Carrick aren't rookies either as none would be eligible for the Calder next year.

They've also never made an NHL roster full time, just a smattering of games here and there, bounced up and down, that's why they still qualify for me.  So NHL rookies, no... prospects... yes.