Goaltending Depth Chart

[Fanatic]

I think Goose looks really uncomfortable out there so far. He seems jittery every time the puck comes his way. Scrivens on the other hand looks cool and very comfortable. I am wondering if the back up to Reimer is really a job that Goose has to earn or if it will be just given to him.

I belive that Rynnas is touted as the starter for the Marlies. So, by my way of thinking, Scrivens is going to be a backup regardless of whether it is with the Marlies or the Leafs.

Does anyone else think that Reimer/Scrivens makes for a better team than Reimer/Gustavsson?

 

[Fanatic]

And now I just see that the Sun has a story making the same point.

http://www.torontosun.com/2011/09/21/buffery-scrivens-deserves-a-shot

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Does anyone else think that Reimer/Scrivens makes for a better team than Reimer/Gustavsson?

Maybe if you're just taking preseason into account for the decision. I believe Gustafsson has to clear waivers and will probably not be exposed, contrary to the belief that he might clear anyway. I don't think that the Leafs will take that chance. I do still think he will show the rookie season Monster play he did back then again, once we get into the regular season. Some players get ready for the season differently, Scrivens is probably jacked up to prove more than Goose right now and that could be the difference.
You never know though, if Goose doesn't bring it during the season and really push Reimer, he could be traded or waived to the minors a few months into the season. Gustafsson will be the back up to Reimer to start the season though IMO.

I do however believe that Scrivens may end up as the Marlies #1, which may end up being better for his development anyway. As good as Scrivens has looked in preseason, I don't think he is ready for the NHL yet. If he has the top lines coming down on him every night he plays, all that confidence could easily be shattered pretty quick IMO. I do think he will be a good goaltender though.

 

[Kin]

And now I just see that the Sun has a story making the same point.

http://www.torontosun.com/2011/09/21/buffery-scrivens-deserves-a-shot

From the same article:

A SLIPPERY SLOPE

Greg Millen, one of the best analysts in hockey broadcasting, had this to say when Luke Schenn was slapped with a questionable boarding penalty in the first period: ?If we?re going to get to that level in the National Hockey League, my goodness, we?re in trouble.? Millen was right on.

No. No thank you.

 

[Fanatic]

No. No thank you.

Everyone is entitled to get one wrong now and then don't ya think?

 

[maplesyrup]

I'm not sure there is much difference between Scrivens and Gustavsson at this point. My very crude understanding is that Gustavsson might have more upside but Scrivens could be the safer bet. Its an interesing battle I think.

 

[Fanatic]

I'm not sure there is much difference between Scrivens and Gustavsson at this point. My very crude understanding is that Gustavsson might have more upside but Scrivens could be the safer bet. Its an interesing battle I think.

But that's the point. I don't think it is actually a battle. I don't think it will matter what Scrivens does - Gustavsson is the starting back up regardless and I am not sure that makes a ton of sense.

 

[Bullfrog]

How would Scrivens, with a grand total of 33 professional games (none at the NHL level) and only two years younger than Gustavsson be a safer bet?

Wouldn't the guy who's played and had some success at the NHL level be a safer bet? While Gustavsson's overall body of work in north american hasn't been stellar, he's shown some stretches of excellent goaltending.

If you're basing your opinion on the very small sample of the preseason games, shouldn't we give some consideration to the very small sample of Gustavsson's AHL experience. You know, where his stats were phenomenal?

 

[maplesyrup]

I'm not sure there is much difference between Scrivens and Gustavsson at this point. My very crude understanding is that Gustavsson might have more upside but Scrivens could be the safer bet. Its an interesing battle I think.

But that's the point. I don't think it is actually a battle. I don't think it will matter what Scrivens does - Gustavsson is the starting back up regardless and I am not sure that makes a ton of sense.

It may or not be a battle at camp (though it should be) but Scrivens playing well early and Gustavsson underachieving will certainly make things interesting early on.

 

[Bullfrog]

And let me clarify: I'm not suggesting that Gustavsson have the backup job handed to him or that Scrivens isn't worthy, I'm suggesting that some of you are rushing to judgement.

If Scrivens is doing so well and showing good potential, why is it assumed that he'll be a backup to Rynnas, especially considering he has better AHL stats then Rynnas?

 

[ZBBM]

Uh, didn't we win the 2 games Gus played in?  As opposed to that seive, Reimer, who got lit up?  Seems to me if anything Reims should start the season in the A.

 

[bustaheims]

Uh, didn't we win the 2 games Gus played in?  As opposed to that seive, Reimer, who got lit up?  Seems to me if anything Reims should start the season in the A.

By that logic, Scrivens should be the starter this season, since he has the best pre-season numbers. ;D

That being said, if things continue as they have been between Scrivens and Gustavsson, it's definitely possible the Monster could end up with the Marlies.

 

[Kin]

As to the general point here, it'd be crazy to go with Scrivens over Gustavsson out of camp no matter who outplays who in camp unless you're absolutely sure Scrivens is going to be an effective NHL backup. If not, you face the very real possibility of losing Gus to waivers, Scrivens being unable to be the back-up this year and the Leafs having little to no options when it comes to a back-up goalie.

On the flip side, if they go with Gus and he struggles they can then face the prospect of losing him and calling up Scrivens. Same result, more or less.

With their #1 being a far from sure thing, the Leafs can't ignore the safer option of giving all of their goalies a try.

 

[Zee]

I would let the season start first, see how Gustavsson plays in regular season games before we go and replace backup goalies.  It's great that Scrivens has looked so comfortable in net so far, but like Reimer last season, he has to wait for his chance.  Who knows it may come this season if Gustavsson falters.  I remember last pre-season Reimer looked like the best goalie of the bunch, but he still had to wait until January before he got his shot.  It's a nice problem to have I think.

 

[cw]

I belive that Rynnas is touted as the starter for the Marlies. So, by my way of thinking, Scrivens is going to be a backup regardless of whether it is with the Marlies or the Leafs.

I think Scrivens has turned that into a very legitimate battle with Rynnas - one where he may well have the edge based upon his play last season.

Of the four goalies, my guess would be that Rynnas is coming in 4th on the depth chart. There's no way I see Rynnas ahead of Gustavsson at this point.

Owuya looks ECHL bound based upon his results to date.

The problem Scrivens has is that if they try to send Gustavsson down, they could lose him whereas they can send Scrivens down without having to expose him to waivers.

Are Reimer and Gustavsson going to play the entire season injury free? That's doubtful so Scrivens will get his shot if he keeps it up.

I think the Sun writer is way over the top claiming Scrivens should get a shot after playing two half games. To take Gustavsson's job, Scrivens is going to have to outplay him substantially. Gustavsson has reportedly looked very good in practice and he played very well in the AHL during his conditioning stint. As neither goalie has let in a bad goal in their 60 minutes of play so far, I don't know how one can solidly make that claim after roughly only 60 minutes of ice time each. It strikes me as kind of crazy & premature or over the top.

 

[Fanatic]

I think Scrivens has turned that into a very legitimate battle with Rynnas - one where he may well have the edge based upon his play last season.

Of the four goalies, my guess would be that Rynnas is coming in 4th on the depth chart. There's no way I see Rynnas ahead of Gustavsson at this point.

Owuya looks ECHL bound based upon his results to date.

The problem Scrivens has is that if they try to send Gustavsson down, they could lose him whereas they can send Scrivens down without having to expose him to waivers.

Are Reimer and Gustavsson going to play the entire season injury free? That's doubtful so Scrivens will get his shot if he keeps it up.

I think the Sun writer is way over the top claiming Scrivens should get a shot after playing two half games. To take Gustavsson's job, Scrivens is going to have to outplay him substantially. Gustavsson has reportedly looked very good in practice and he played very well in the AHL during his conditioning stint. As neither goalie has let in a bad goal in their 60 minutes of play so far, I don't know how one can solidly make that claim after roughly only 60 minutes of ice time each. It strikes me as kind of crazy & premature or over the top.

I will be the first to admit I did not watch a lot of hockey last year - I was dealing with too many other things and missed most of the season. But from what I did pick up I was just not a fan of Gustavsson and wondered if he is still clearly the #2 man or not.

So, do you think it is:

1. Reimer
2. Goose
3. Rynnas - starter for Marlies
4. Scrivens - back up for Marlies
5. Owuya - ECHL

 

[bustaheims]

While keeping Gustavsson up may be the safer option in terms of asset retention, considering how tight the race for the final playoff spots is likely to be, can the Leafs really risk putting Gustavsson out there and potentially missing out on valuable points if he hasn't actually outplayed Scrivens? Sure, it's still early in the pre-season, but, there are certainly signs that Scrivens may be the better option. As much as I'm all for smart asset management, I don't think it should be placed ahead of the quality of the on-ice product - especially where goaltending is concerned. Quite frankly, unless Gustavsson raises his game over the course of the pre-season, I have little doubt he'll easily clear waivers, as he has shown himself to be more than a inconsistent back-up type so far.

 

[Fanatic]

While keeping Gustavsson up may be the safer option in terms of asset retention, considering how tight the race for the final playoff spots is likely to be, can the Leafs really risk putting Gustavsson out there and potentially missing out on valuable points if he hasn't actually outplayed Scrivens? Sure, it's still early in the pre-season, but, there are certainly signs that Scrivens may be the better option. As much as I'm all for smart asset management, I don't think it should be placed ahead of the quality of the on-ice product - especially where goaltending is concerned. Quite frankly, unless Gustavsson raises his game over the course of the pre-season, I have little doubt he'll easily clear waivers, as he has shown himself to be more than a inconsistent back-up type so far.

I am a bit slow on this point myself, but it is making sense now.

Since no one really knows from a few pre-season games if Scrivens is better than Gustavsson how can you risk loosing Gus on waivers when the safer bet allows you to keep them all?

Does anyone really think Gus would be taken on waivers?

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

While keeping Gustavsson up may be the safer option in terms of asset retention, considering how tight the race for the final playoff spots is likely to be, can the Leafs really risk putting Gustavsson out there and potentially missing out on valuable points if he hasn't actually outplayed Scrivens? Sure, it's still early in the pre-season, but, there are certainly signs that Scrivens may be the better option. As much as I'm all for smart asset management, I don't think it should be placed ahead of the quality of the on-ice product - especially where goaltending is concerned. Quite frankly, unless Gustavsson raises his game over the course of the pre-season, I have little doubt he'll easily clear waivers, as he has shown himself to be more than a inconsistent back-up type so far.

I agree, if he can't cut the mustard quickly into the season, Burke will have to react soon I think. There isn't too much time and or points to give away this season.

 

[bustaheims]

I am a bit slow on this point myself, but it is making sense now.

Since no one really knows from a few pre-season games if Scrivens is better than Gustavsson how can you risk loosing Gus on waivers when the safer bet allows you to keep them all?

Well, the question really is what's more important to the team - not losing Gustavsson or not losing points in the standings? At the end of the day, the team has to go with the roster that they feel gives them the best chance of winning as many points as possible. If that doesn't include Gustavsson, then they have to risk losing him on waivers.

Does anyone really think Gus would be taken on waivers?

Some people do, but I certainly don't. I look at it this way - there are very few teams in the league where Gustavsson really even represents a potential upgrade on their back up based on his overall play at the NHL level (in most cases, it would essentially be a sideways move), so, you have to ask yourself, do any of those teams want to pay $1.4M for a back up goalie? Outside of a handful of teams who are already paying their back up similar money, my guess is, outside of an injury, the answer in most, if not, all cases would be no. Outside of maybe Columbus (who are probably already pressing up to their internal cap), I don't see a single team in the league who would put a claim in on Gustavsson right now.