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sens @ Maple Leafs - Nov. 8th, 7:00pm - SN, Fan 590

Started by CarltonTheBear, November 07, 2023, 09:13:03 PM

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Chris

Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 10:27:23 PMTell you what I am going to do.  I'm going to cancel my monthly Patreon payment to this site, and just stop coming by.  That way you don't have to read my "comical" and "funny as hell" rants about the Leafs when they suffer a loss, and I don't have to be taken to task and talked down too by some elitist positive thinker just because I have a negative emotional reaction to the way the Leafs play.

I wish you all the best.     

I've been where you are. Haven't posted in 2 years. Not sure I'm going to be posting much but just wanted to say, hope you'll reconsider but I do understand if you don't.


Quote from: Zee on November 09, 2023, 09:26:03 AMNo reason to get like this.  At the end of the day it's just a game and a hockey team.  I've been watching the Leafs almost 50 years so I've run the gamut of emotions for this team and it's just not worth it.  Sure I would be over the moon if they ever win a Cup, but i'm not going to let their poor play dictate my mood anymore.  There are way more important things in life.  Hockey is a distraction, can be great at times, but shouldn't bring you down and get you all pissed off either.

We all have different opinions on this team, it's what makes this site worth coming to.  Some are constantly negative, some are overly optimistic and a bunch are in the middle with a wait and see attitude.  It's still early, changes can happen.  Imagine how we would have felt as St. Louis fans the year they were DEAD LAST in the NHL in January and somehow still won the Cup that year? You never know what can change on a team.

I've finally accepted that this team is just too flawed and not championship-caliber. I mean, maybe if the stars truly align and half the Vegas team winds up on LTIR come playoff time (same for Colorado and several other teams), and Matthews goes on an incredible heater and one of the goalies becomes...well, you know what the chances of all of that are.

We all know the problems - too much money tied up in a few offensive players who don't have that extra "compete" gene, haphazardly constructed lower two lines, aging defenders who are not good defensively, one goalie who is a head case and the other is young and injury prone. I'm hoping that when the Tavares contract runs out, maybe...maybe at that point the team can be retooled, money redistributed, maybe one of the core forwards (Marner or Nylander) gets traded to balance out the rest of the team. Maybe at that point a new "window" opens up for this team. Until then, I am just watching purely for entertainment and no longer investing as much of myself into a group of players (note that I don't use the word team) that doesn't seem to care enough about each other.

BTW, someone had posted something about Nylander talking about "adversity." What adversity has this group ever really faced? More and more I find myself thinking they'd be much better off if they'd actually missed the playoffs once or twice along the way. Maybe this year.


Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate

Quote from: Chris on November 09, 2023, 11:42:41 AM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 10:27:23 PMTell you what I am going to do.  I'm going to cancel my monthly Patreon payment to this site, and just stop coming by.  That way you don't have to read my "comical" and "funny as hell" rants about the Leafs when they suffer a loss, and I don't have to be taken to task and talked down too by some elitist positive thinker just because I have a negative emotional reaction to the way the Leafs play.

I wish you all the best.     

I've been where you are. Haven't posted in 2 years. Not sure I'm going to be posting much but just wanted to say, hope you'll reconsider but I do understand if you don't.


Quote from: Zee on November 09, 2023, 09:26:03 AMNo reason to get like this.  At the end of the day it's just a game and a hockey team.  I've been watching the Leafs almost 50 years so I've run the gamut of emotions for this team and it's just not worth it.  Sure I would be over the moon if they ever win a Cup, but i'm not going to let their poor play dictate my mood anymore.  There are way more important things in life.  Hockey is a distraction, can be great at times, but shouldn't bring you down and get you all pissed off either.

We all have different opinions on this team, it's what makes this site worth coming to.  Some are constantly negative, some are overly optimistic and a bunch are in the middle with a wait and see attitude.  It's still early, changes can happen.  Imagine how we would have felt as St. Louis fans the year they were DEAD LAST in the NHL in January and somehow still won the Cup that year? You never know what can change on a team.

I've finally accepted that this team is just too flawed and not championship-caliber. I mean, maybe if the stars truly align and half the Vegas team winds up on LTIR come playoff time (same for Colorado and several other teams), and Matthews goes on an incredible heater and one of the goalies becomes...well, you know what the chances of all of that are.

We all know the problems - too much money tied up in a few offensive players who don't have that extra "compete" gene, haphazardly constructed lower two lines, aging defenders who are not good defensively, one goalie who is a head case and the other is young and injury prone. I'm hoping that when the Tavares contract runs out, maybe...maybe at that point the team can be retooled, money redistributed, maybe one of the core forwards (Marner or Nylander) gets traded to balance out the rest of the team. Maybe at that point a new "window" opens up for this team. Until then, I am just watching purely for entertainment and no longer investing as much of myself into a group of players (note that I don't use the word team) that doesn't seem to care enough about each other.

BTW, someone had posted something about Nylander talking about "adversity." What adversity has this group ever really faced? More and more I find myself thinking they'd be much better off if they'd actually missed the playoffs once or twice along the way. Maybe this year.

This is a darned good post.

Highlander

Quote from: Zee on November 09, 2023, 09:26:03 AM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 10:27:23 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 10:03:42 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:50:30 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 09:45:21 PM
Quote from: Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate on November 08, 2023, 09:38:14 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:36:21 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 09:29:18 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:26:22 PMGood to see we all over-reacted to Woll's fast start.
Woll is fine. Just a bad game.

Just a bad game?  Here are his last 4 starts:

Nov 8, 23 vs OTT L 27 6 .778
Nov 6, 23 vs TBL W 19 1 .947
Nov 4, 23 vs BUF L 40 5 .875
Oct 31, 23 vs LAK L 27 4 .852

It's not a bad start, it's a regression to the mean.  He isn't a goalie of the future, he's a failed Leaf prospect.

Oh come on.  I get you're upset but this is just silly.
No kidding. Some like to overreact....it's actually pretty comical.

Thanks anti-azzuri.  Love your objectivity.  Just because you want everything to be positive doesn't make it positive.  A person who never wants to see flaws in something can be annoying too as well as comical.
Where did I say they didn't have flaws? They do but the overreactions after goals/losses by some here is funny as hell. Trade everyone, team's embarrassing, failed prospect, etc., etc.

Well I'm glad you are the type of person who laughs when other people are upset.

Tell you what I am going to do.  I'm going to cancel my monthly Patreon payment to this site, and just stop coming by.  That way you don't have to read my "comical" and "funny as hell" rants about the Leafs when they suffer a loss, and I don't have to be taken to task and talked down too by some elitist positive thinker just because I have a negative emotional reaction to the way the Leafs play.

I wish you all the best.     

No reason to get like this.  At the end of the day it's just a game and a hockey team.  I've been watching the Leafs almost 50 years so I've run the gamut of emotions for this team and it's just not worth it.  Sure I would be over the moon if they ever win a Cup, but i'm not going to let their poor play dictate my mood anymore.  There are way more important things in life.  Hockey is a distraction, can be great at times, but shouldn't bring you down and get you all pissed off either.

We all have different opinions on this team, it's what makes this site worth coming to.  Some are constantly negative, some are overly optimistic and a bunch are in the middle with a wait and see attitude.  It's still early, changes can happen.  Imagine how we would have felt as St. Louis fans the year they were DEAD LAST in the NHL in January and somehow still won the Cup that year? You never know what can change on a team.

Its entertainment, that's all, if you make something more than that, then this is you reality. If its not fun, don't do it, simple. If its painful and heartbreaking from you to watch the Leafs then stop doing it. Simple.
I have been watching this team for most of my 67 years and it been a lot worse than this. 
Now, I simply enjoy watching the amazing skill and speed of the game.  Simple
"In the beginners mind there are many possibilities, but in the expert's there are few"
                                           Sunryn Suzuki

Highlander

Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 10:09:08 PM
Quote from: Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate on November 08, 2023, 10:04:31 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:48:48 PM
Quote from: Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate on November 08, 2023, 09:38:14 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:36:21 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 09:29:18 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:26:22 PMGood to see we all over-reacted to Woll's fast start.
Woll is fine. Just a bad game.

Just a bad game?  Here are his last 4 starts:

Nov 8, 23 vs OTT L 27 6 .778
Nov 6, 23 vs TBL W 19 1 .947
Nov 4, 23 vs BUF L 40 5 .875
Oct 31, 23 vs LAK L 27 4 .852

It's not a bad start, it's a regression to the mean.  He isn't a goalie of the future, he's a failed Leaf prospect.

Oh come on.  I get you're upset but this is just silly.

Look, we've seen this play out before, many times.  Pogge, Gustavson, Reimer, Sparks...and the list goes on.  Sure other teams get good goalies that come up from the minors and do amazing this.  I get how Leafs fans think it's possible, but  this is the Leafs though.  That doesn't happen for this team.  Why would it?

Can you tell me that you looked at his game tonight and think that Woll is destined to become a top 15 goalie in the League?  If we can all jump on the bandwagon after 2 good games, why and I not able to remove the screws from the wheels on said bandwagon after three really bad games? 

He's young, a rookie.  The promise you see is his frame, flexibility, and positioning.  I have no idea whether he'll pan out as a top 15, but calling him a failure on the basis of 4 recent games is just nonsensical.
Wasting your time ZBBM...Woll's a failure...all over for him. Team sucks too.
What GT,  I expect more from my positive friend. Woll is going to be a great one.
"In the beginners mind there are many possibilities, but in the expert's there are few"
                                           Sunryn Suzuki

Bender

Quote from: Highlander on November 09, 2023, 01:10:53 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 10:09:08 PM
Quote from: Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate on November 08, 2023, 10:04:31 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:48:48 PM
Quote from: Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate on November 08, 2023, 09:38:14 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:36:21 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 09:29:18 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:26:22 PMGood to see we all over-reacted to Woll's fast start.
Woll is fine. Just a bad game.

Just a bad game?  Here are his last 4 starts:

Nov 8, 23 vs OTT L 27 6 .778
Nov 6, 23 vs TBL W 19 1 .947
Nov 4, 23 vs BUF L 40 5 .875
Oct 31, 23 vs LAK L 27 4 .852

It's not a bad start, it's a regression to the mean.  He isn't a goalie of the future, he's a failed Leaf prospect.

Oh come on.  I get you're upset but this is just silly.

Look, we've seen this play out before, many times.  Pogge, Gustavson, Reimer, Sparks...and the list goes on.  Sure other teams get good goalies that come up from the minors and do amazing this.  I get how Leafs fans think it's possible, but  this is the Leafs though.  That doesn't happen for this team.  Why would it?

Can you tell me that you looked at his game tonight and think that Woll is destined to become a top 15 goalie in the League?  If we can all jump on the bandwagon after 2 good games, why and I not able to remove the screws from the wheels on said bandwagon after three really bad games? 

He's young, a rookie.  The promise you see is his frame, flexibility, and positioning.  I have no idea whether he'll pan out as a top 15, but calling him a failure on the basis of 4 recent games is just nonsensical.
Wasting your time ZBBM...Woll's a failure...all over for him. Team sucks too.
What GT,  I expect more from my positive friend. Woll is going to be a great one.

I think that's sarcasm from GT :D
"They say you can judge a man by the company he keeps. So here is the professor's oldest friend, a grotesque, stinking lobster." - Bender

Highlander

Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 09:29:18 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:26:22 PMGood to see we all over-reacted to Woll's fast start.
Woll is fine. Just a bad game.
I think I just called you out, sorry, must of been someone else beating on Woll.
"In the beginners mind there are many possibilities, but in the expert's there are few"
                                           Sunryn Suzuki

Highlander

Sometimes, we are so invested in our favorite sports teams that we experience symptoms of sports fan depression when they lose a big game or when the season comes to a close. These symptoms can cause serious harm, but the good news is that there are effective techniques for recovering from sports fan depression

Google
"In the beginners mind there are many possibilities, but in the expert's there are few"
                                           Sunryn Suzuki

Highlander

Cheering on one's favorite sports team or simply enjoying a good competition should always be a relaxed and positive experience. It is a time when people spend their hard-earned money to escape their busy lives for a few hours, and fill it with excitement and happiness amongst family, friends and fellow fans. Yet, if any of you have ever been to a sporting event, you know there are always those fans, intoxicated or sober, which rather choose to fill that time with negativity, having no regard to how it negatively affects those around them.

"In the beginners mind there are many possibilities, but in the expert's there are few"
                                           Sunryn Suzuki

Guilt Trip

Quote from: Highlander on November 09, 2023, 01:14:05 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 09:29:18 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:26:22 PMGood to see we all over-reacted to Woll's fast start.
Woll is fine. Just a bad game.
I think I just called you out, sorry, must of been someone else beating on Woll.
All good High! No worries! Cheers

Guilt Trip

Quote from: Highlander on November 09, 2023, 01:08:38 PM
Quote from: Zee on November 09, 2023, 09:26:03 AM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 10:27:23 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 10:03:42 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:50:30 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 09:45:21 PM
Quote from: Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate on November 08, 2023, 09:38:14 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:36:21 PM
Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 08, 2023, 09:29:18 PM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 09:26:22 PMGood to see we all over-reacted to Woll's fast start.
Woll is fine. Just a bad game.

Just a bad game?  Here are his last 4 starts:

Nov 8, 23 vs OTT L 27 6 .778
Nov 6, 23 vs TBL W 19 1 .947
Nov 4, 23 vs BUF L 40 5 .875
Oct 31, 23 vs LAK L 27 4 .852

It's not a bad start, it's a regression to the mean.  He isn't a goalie of the future, he's a failed Leaf prospect.

Oh come on.  I get you're upset but this is just silly.
No kidding. Some like to overreact....it's actually pretty comical.

Thanks anti-azzuri.  Love your objectivity.  Just because you want everything to be positive doesn't make it positive.  A person who never wants to see flaws in something can be annoying too as well as comical.
Where did I say they didn't have flaws? They do but the overreactions after goals/losses by some here is funny as hell. Trade everyone, team's embarrassing, failed prospect, etc., etc.

Well I'm glad you are the type of person who laughs when other people are upset.

Tell you what I am going to do.  I'm going to cancel my monthly Patreon payment to this site, and just stop coming by.  That way you don't have to read my "comical" and "funny as hell" rants about the Leafs when they suffer a loss, and I don't have to be taken to task and talked down too by some elitist positive thinker just because I have a negative emotional reaction to the way the Leafs play.

I wish you all the best.     

No reason to get like this.  At the end of the day it's just a game and a hockey team.  I've been watching the Leafs almost 50 years so I've run the gamut of emotions for this team and it's just not worth it.  Sure I would be over the moon if they ever win a Cup, but i'm not going to let their poor play dictate my mood anymore.  There are way more important things in life.  Hockey is a distraction, can be great at times, but shouldn't bring you down and get you all pissed off either.

We all have different opinions on this team, it's what makes this site worth coming to.  Some are constantly negative, some are overly optimistic and a bunch are in the middle with a wait and see attitude.  It's still early, changes can happen.  Imagine how we would have felt as St. Louis fans the year they were DEAD LAST in the NHL in January and somehow still won the Cup that year? You never know what can change on a team.

Its entertainment, that's all, if you make something more than that, then this is you reality. If its not fun, don't do it, simple. If its painful and heartbreaking from you to watch the Leafs then stop doing it. Simple.
I have been watching this team for most of my 67 years and it been a lot worse than this. 
Now, I simply enjoy watching the amazing skill and speed of the game.  Simple
I'm with you..never seen a Leafs team so talented. Enjoy watching the skill. Leafs will always be my team and I'm old enough to share that this is a great time to be a Leafs fan. Man there were some brutal teams in the past 50.

Guilt Trip

#146
Quote from: herman on November 09, 2023, 10:32:35 AMhttps://twitter.com/frankcorrado22/status/1722637830868848759
Kampf lost coverage here, but the basic premise is, he feels the need to do more than his job (play defenseman+). Again, I think Reaves positionally fine but not in position to truly help.

https://twitter.com/JhanHky/status/1722467900013899978
Agree on the Kampf thing but why is Gregor the first guy back? I mean really shouldn't it be a D man. They not reading the play right or are they just flat out too slow? This isn't the first time it's happened where Kampf gets caught out and both happened when Gregor was the first guy back covering for the Dmen.
I liked Han's explanation better.

Bill_Berg

Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 09, 2023, 09:58:31 AM
Quote from: Zee on November 09, 2023, 09:26:03 AMAt the end of the day it's just a game and a hockey team
Quote from: Zee on November 09, 2023, 09:26:03 AMThere are way more important things in life.  Hockey is a distraction, can be great at times, but shouldn't bring you down and get you all pissed off either.
Absolutely. I've said literally the same thing for years. It's hockey/entertainment. What will you get if they win it all? You're not making the millions or getting your name on the cup so why get bent about a game you have no control over? Enjoy the ride, it's a long season. Win or lose, my summer's are always great.


Logic and emotions man, they don't talk to each other.

Arn

Quote from: Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate on November 09, 2023, 11:55:59 AM
Quote from: Chris on November 09, 2023, 11:42:41 AM
Quote from: Significantly Insignificant on November 08, 2023, 10:27:23 PMTell you what I am going to do.  I'm going to cancel my monthly Patreon payment to this site, and just stop coming by.  That way you don't have to read my "comical" and "funny as hell" rants about the Leafs when they suffer a loss, and I don't have to be taken to task and talked down too by some elitist positive thinker just because I have a negative emotional reaction to the way the Leafs play.

I wish you all the best.     

I've been where you are. Haven't posted in 2 years. Not sure I'm going to be posting much but just wanted to say, hope you'll reconsider but I do understand if you don't.


Quote from: Zee on November 09, 2023, 09:26:03 AMNo reason to get like this.  At the end of the day it's just a game and a hockey team.  I've been watching the Leafs almost 50 years so I've run the gamut of emotions for this team and it's just not worth it.  Sure I would be over the moon if they ever win a Cup, but i'm not going to let their poor play dictate my mood anymore.  There are way more important things in life.  Hockey is a distraction, can be great at times, but shouldn't bring you down and get you all pissed off either.

We all have different opinions on this team, it's what makes this site worth coming to.  Some are constantly negative, some are overly optimistic and a bunch are in the middle with a wait and see attitude.  It's still early, changes can happen.  Imagine how we would have felt as St. Louis fans the year they were DEAD LAST in the NHL in January and somehow still won the Cup that year? You never know what can change on a team.

I've finally accepted that this team is just too flawed and not championship-caliber. I mean, maybe if the stars truly align and half the Vegas team winds up on LTIR come playoff time (same for Colorado and several other teams), and Matthews goes on an incredible heater and one of the goalies becomes...well, you know what the chances of all of that are.

We all know the problems - too much money tied up in a few offensive players who don't have that extra "compete" gene, haphazardly constructed lower two lines, aging defenders who are not good defensively, one goalie who is a head case and the other is young and injury prone. I'm hoping that when the Tavares contract runs out, maybe...maybe at that point the team can be retooled, money redistributed, maybe one of the core forwards (Marner or Nylander) gets traded to balance out the rest of the team. Maybe at that point a new "window" opens up for this team. Until then, I am just watching purely for entertainment and no longer investing as much of myself into a group of players (note that I don't use the word team) that doesn't seem to care enough about each other.

BTW, someone had posted something about Nylander talking about "adversity." What adversity has this group ever really faced? More and more I find myself thinking they'd be much better off if they'd actually missed the playoffs once or twice along the way. Maybe this year.

This is a darned good post.

It is.

While I obviously would ultimately love to see the Leafs win it all, realistically they've a 1 in 32 chance really in a given year. So the chances are they aren't winning anything.

So as long as they're competitive on a given night (which they have been for the last lot of years in the main), they have a direction or plan (again they mostly do even if you don't agree with it at least you can see the theory), and there's other things worth watching like Matthew's goal scoring or Marner's skill etc then I'm happy to tune in as and when.

 
I Saw Jay McClement Score.

herman

Quote from: Guilt Trip on November 09, 2023, 01:54:40 PMAgree on the Kampf thing but why is Gregor the first guy back? I mean really shouldn't it be a D man. They not reading the play right or are they just flat out too slow? This isn't the first time it's happened where Kampf gets caught out and both happened when Gregor was the first guy back covering for the Dmen.
I liked Han's explanation better.

I think it was too slow on the initial quick up, and then braindead on the sort out once Ottawa set up.

Kampf was in on the original possession as F2 supporting above Reaves on the strong side towards the tail end of their shift after a good sequence earlier. The sens poked it behind their net and hinged it to the weakside skater, who made an outlet icing pass to the guy who was busting up ice on the initial turnover (set play punt?).

Gregor recognized the turnover immediately and humped it back; on top of being fast, that recognition helped him push the play to safe ice (behind the goal line).

Giordano recognized it too, but he's 40 and had just pinched down the half wall. He settled into support position in front of Woll.

Klingberg saw Gregor and released F1 and went into NZ forecheck mode and sagged to gap up a potential carry, before pivoting to come back to support Gregor. Either don't chase below the line, or chase all the way to check Stutzle. Got caught in the middle chasing the semi-loose puck.

Kampf and Reaves were still at the OZ hashmarks when the outlet pass was made. Reaves checked up at his wing zone on the high man.

Kampf sees Klingberg chase low, so drops down to the post to cover for the D but the puck is already chipped to a now completely unmarked Stutzle, and the high slot left wide open.

So yeah, Kampf is out of position on the shot, but he was trying to cover for Klingberg who just was straight up ineffective.
#27 #TeamFasstholes