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Kyle Dubas not returning as GM

Started by CarltonTheBear, May 19, 2023, 10:58:11 AM

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Dappleganger

#255
Anyone interested in Ray Shero for the Leafs GM job? Stanley Cup winner...


L K

Quote from: CarltonTheBear on May 23, 2023, 11:23:26 AM
Quote from: L K on May 23, 2023, 11:12:34 AMI don't think he's a terrible option as GM but he seems like a Melba toast selection

He's the best most mediocre option available probably. The Flames averaged 93 points a season with him as GM. So continually stuck between being bad enough to get a good draft pick and good enough to actually compete for the Cup. They won 2 playoff series and missed the playoffs 4 times. Regular season points percentage over .600 just twice. Coaches he hired were: Glen Gulutzan (who?), Bill Peters (ugh), and Darryl Sutter. Sutter's the interesting one since he arguably both saved his job in 21/22 and then later cost him his job in 22/23, and by also most accounts was a hire that ownership kinda/sorta forced on him.

Can we do worse? Sure. Can we do better with all of MLSE's vast resources? Well, apparently not.

I get that the media is going to throw stuff at the wall just for page views (poor Dreger not being able to throw Nonis' name around) but it really feels like the organization wants to regress and I hate it.

CarltonTheBear

I will say maybe the media is wrong and Shanahan's GM search won't essentially be "let's just call the last GM to get fired". Fingers crossed.

Peter D.

Quote from: CarltonTheBear on May 23, 2023, 11:36:13 AMI will say maybe the media is wrong and Shanahan's GM search won't essentially be "let's just call the last GM to get fired". Fingers crossed.

The Toronto media over sensatualizing something?  No chance.

herman

I think the Board ousted Dubas because he was angling to trade Marner before July.
#27 #TeamFasstholes

Nik

Quote from: herman on May 23, 2023, 11:40:20 AMI think the Board ousted Dubas because he was angling to trade Marner before July.

Alright, now you're selling me on firing him again.
I wish to hell I'd never said "Winning isn't everything it's the only thing". What I believe is, if you go out on a football field, or any endeavour in life, and you leave every fibre of what you have on the field, then you've won.
- Vince Lombardi

cw

Quote from: Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate on May 23, 2023, 10:28:54 AM
Quote from: CarltonTheBear on May 23, 2023, 08:52:31 AMI could somewhat understand the concern levels if Dubas like took his entire family on a 2-week vacation to Costa Rica to ponder his future or something, but the dude was back in the office working on Wednesday. That comment was way overblown.

Well, the fanbase didn't generate the angst.  Shanahan said the comments were the beginning of his second thoughts.

https://ca.style.yahoo.com/maple-leafs-president-brendan-shanahan-reveals-why-he-fired-gm-kyle-dubas-211839443.html
Quote"The next day though, I would say while watching Kyle's press [conference]... I think at that point, there was a dramatic shift in my thinking as I drove home that night as Kyle expressed, he may not want to be our GM and I have to take that very seriously," Shanahan continued.

"As I said to him the day before, I understood those feelings and the pressure players are under, the pressure management, coaches, family members are under. But it was a very real possibility at that point that I would be needing to look somewhere else. As part of my job, that is what I began to do while still hoping Kyle and I would come to some resolution."

Dubas gave Shanahan, the board, anyone related to the team and the fans cause to be concerned with his remarks outlining uncertainty. Shanahan suddenly had to begin to prepare for potentially getting a new GM.

Quote"You're talking about the Vatican if you're Catholic, you're talking the centre of the hockey universe, you're talking about one of the most important jobs in hockey, running the Toronto Maple Leafs," Burke said. "It's a dream job."

cw


herman

Quote from: Nik on May 23, 2023, 11:43:44 AM
Quote from: herman on May 23, 2023, 11:40:20 AMI think the Board ousted Dubas because he was angling to trade Marner before July.

Alright, now you're selling me on firing him again.

Teehee

Red yarn wall:

One of the main points of contention has been GM autonomy. Friedman has clarified it wasn't about outright autonomy, but more of streamlining the decision making process (i.e. the Board without a CEO is a mess) so the hockey ops team can take full advantage of time-sensitive windows of opportunity.

CJ talks about how the front office was reeling over the game 3 dead cat bounce of a game. They were ready to move off the We Can and We Will.

I recall one of the key points when the Board has stepped in on decisions in the past: Signing Mitch Marner's 2nd contract so that it doesn't turn into a Nylander situation.

Shanahan performs his DoPS video review of the negotiation process, masking the airing of dirty laundry with the veneer of factual record (so you don't notice any omissions because of how much he is revealing). He definitely walks back Dubas's big changes coming remarks. CJ further reports Shanahan makes mollifying calls to the core 4 to give the impression they're staying.
#27 #TeamFasstholes

Significantly Insignificant

I'm not really sure why everyone is getting all worked up.  Being the GM of the Leafs this summer is really straight forward.

1.  Ship Matthews and Marner to Chicago for the first overall pick and Seth Jones.
2.  Sign Matt Dumba, Nylander, Acciari, ROR, Kampf.
3.  Hire a coach that likes to win 1-0 games

Seems easy.
"We can't change what's done, we can only move on." - Arthur Morgan

bustaheims

Quote from: CarltonTheBear on May 23, 2023, 11:36:13 AMI will say maybe the media is wrong and Shanahan's GM search won't essentially be "let's just call the last GM to get fired". Fingers crossed.

It is quite astounding how quickly Treliving got the job. It's like he was hired before the team even started the interview process. He practically had the job before Dubas was even let go. ;)
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

CarltonTheBear

After a few days of thinking about it it's still just hard to believe that this is where we're at.

If Dubas didn't want to return as Leafs GM, for whatever reason, that would have sucked but fully been his right with his contract expiring. If the Leafs wanted to make a change at GM due to the lack of playoff success the team has had under Dubas, it would have been something I disagreed with but at least there's some justification there I could understand.

Instead we have a situation where on Thursday morning everyone (Dubas, Shanny, MLSE) woke up hoping that Dubas' 9 year relationship with the team was going to continue. On Friday morning Shanny and/or MLSE decided to cut things off entirely. I just can't really fathom how whatever differences popped up over the course of the day on Thursday weren't something that could have been resolved with a little bit of time and discussion.

Significantly Insignificant

Quote from: Nik on May 23, 2023, 09:05:02 AM
Quote from: CarltonTheBear on May 23, 2023, 08:52:31 AMI could somewhat understand the concern levels if Dubas like took his entire family on a 2-week vacation to Costa Rica to ponder his future or something, but the dude was back in the office working on Wednesday. That comment was way overblown.

It's just another example of how the fanbase creates problems for itself. Fans pay way too much attention to clean out the locker room day so if something is said that upsets them it's attached significance because they care so much about clean out the locker room day. Why would anyone care what gets said on that day if it doesn't then conform to anything that actually happens?

If I could be a relatively informed fan without knowing the GM's name it would make no difference to me. I'm a fan of the hockey team, not the corporate structure.

I'm not even a fan of the team.  I just love this forum, so I watch them so I can contribute.
"We can't change what's done, we can only move on." - Arthur Morgan

Rob

I wonder if Dubas will apply for the position. 

CarltonTheBear

#269
https://twitter.com/DarrenDreger/status/1661066475564679176

LeBrun, Friedman, Mirtle, Johnston all at least floated his name out there. Like I said before, he never seemed likely but wonder where that all came from.

It's also funny to see CJ retweet this just now. "I'm a serious hockey insider who previously wrote there's been industry buzz about the possibility of Armstrong coming to Toronto and apparently that was all a complete fabrication. My bad! Don't forget to place your bet on TOR's next GM at dumbbettingsite.com"