Author Topic: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?  (Read 1417 times)

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Offline WhatIfGodWasALeaf

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Re: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?
« Reply #30 on: February 06, 2018, 10:14:19 AM »
I take your point, but the flip side of that is that he has been heavily sheltered in a third line role.

So can you justify paying him as a top-six winger when you need to play him in a third line role to prevent him being victimized defensively?

But the flip side of THAT is that if he was playing on the top line he goes from Bozak to Kadri or even Matthews. So quality of competition might go up but so does quality of team mates. And JVR's shown in the past (when he played with Kessel) that he can produce on a top line. Granted they played a run-and-guny style that wouldn't work with Babcock but I don't really have much doubt that JVR would put up impressive numbers with Matthews.

But I do agree with your general point, and I've said it myself recently that if the Leafs are even remotely considering re-signing JVR they have to try him in the top-6, preferably with Matthews. I agree completely that you can't have him playing under 15 minutes if you're going to give him $6mil-ish.

He can produce offensively sure, but that line got murdered defensively most nights (I know, not just his fault), I don't think you can say that it shows he can play in a first line role.

In general, I agree with you and herman, I doubt he gets moved.

Worse case scenario for me is that they get mauled in the first round and JVR walks as a UFA, that would be an absolute disaster and the opposite of what a management group looking to build a perennial contender should do.

Cap space is great, but you need to be honest about the player and the team and act accordingly in the big picture sense.

Online CarltonTheBear

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Re: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?
« Reply #31 on: February 06, 2018, 10:17:52 AM »
Kapanen-Matthews-Hyman
Marleau-Kadri-Marner
Johnsson-Nylander-Brown
Soshnikov-Komarov-Levio

That 12 plus whatever trade return you get from JVR and Bozak seems like a smarter move to me.

Trying to stay realistic, for this season I would drop Leivo over Soshnikov right now to make room on the roster, and basically go into the playoffs with what we have. If I could unload Bozak or Komarov or Martin at the deadline I would, but I don't see management doing it.

In the offseason, let Bozak and Komarov walk. Trade Martin for whatever you can get. Re-sign JVR to an Oshie deal. Sign a speedy 4C type, or use Aaltonen if the group thinks he can fill that role. Go into next season with:

JVR-Matthews-Kapanen
Marleau-Kadri-Marner
Hyman-Nylander-Brown
Johnsson-Aaltonen-Soshnikov

With a possible $82mil cap, and with Nylander and Marner's extensions possibly looking like they could be more like Pasta's deal than say Draisaitl's, I think we probably have a little more cap room than we figure. And in the near-ish future we'd still have Marleau and Hainsey's deals coming off the books for later cap relief.

Online herman

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Re: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?
« Reply #32 on: February 06, 2018, 10:32:39 AM »
Basically, they should have moved JvR a year or two ago, but clearly felt that holding pat for the playoff experience was more valuable than the offers they were receiving. Trade value is probably too low now, compared to what JvR remaining on the team provides (3rd line overmatch is critical to success, in my observation).

Him re-signing with us is not completely out of the picture, and with expansion in Seattle looming, there's an opportunity to shed a bad cap hit through exposure, either by making JvR more palatable or getting rid of him entirely.

Pros for keeping JvR:
- health nut
- hockey nut
- loves Toronto
- scores 30 goals with 12 min a night, so...

There's value (to the room) in re-signing JvR, rather than ruthlessly dumping him for asset management reasons (even though I'd prefer that route for non-core players). Superstars are more likely to stay if they see their peers/friends treated well.

My optimal keep-JvR solution (for next season) is to get a true shutdown C (Mikael Backlund) and reconfigure to suit. Kadri is a huge upgrade over Bozak.

Hyman - Matthews - Nylander
Marleau - Backlund - Kapanen/Brown
JvR - Kadri - Marner
Johnsson - Whoever* - Brown/Kapanen

* maybe even Komarov, but probably a righty is preferred

Online CarltonTheBear

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Re: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?
« Reply #33 on: February 06, 2018, 10:41:34 AM »
Him re-signing with us is not completely out of the picture, and with expansion in Seattle looming, there's an opportunity to shed a bad cap hit through exposure, either by making JvR more palatable or getting rid of him entirely.

This isn't something that's been looked at yet really (and it is still far away), but we're almost certainly going to lose a pretty good player or asset there.

Online herman

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Re: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?
« Reply #34 on: February 06, 2018, 10:44:50 AM »
Him re-signing with us is not completely out of the picture, and with expansion in Seattle looming, there's an opportunity to shed a bad cap hit through exposure, either by making JvR more palatable or getting rid of him entirely.

This isn't something that's been looked at yet really (and it is still far away), but we're almost certainly going to lose a pretty good player or asset there.

Right. Sign JvR this offseason, either lose JvR to expansion later when he's 31/32, or shed a different salary. With the way Vegas went and Seattle insisting on the same expansion rules, pretty sure there will be side deals galore, and this time we're going to need to use that.

Offline cabber24

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Re: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?
« Reply #35 on: February 06, 2018, 01:44:53 PM »


If we do trade Leivo and Sosh I feel it compounds the problem of losing our UFAs. Maybe we should just say to bad so sad to Leivo and Sosh. We're not trading you and you're not playing until maybe next year. We're still amazingly healthy and it's shocking these guys haven't had more opportunity to play.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2018, 01:55:43 PM by cabber24 »
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Offline Nik the Trik

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Re: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?
« Reply #36 on: February 06, 2018, 02:49:15 PM »
There's value (to the room) in re-signing JvR, rather than ruthlessly dumping him for asset management reasons (even though I'd prefer that route for non-core players). Superstars are more likely to stay if they see their peers/friends treated well.

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Offline Big Daddy

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Re: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?
« Reply #37 on: February 07, 2018, 01:44:29 PM »
Kapanen-Matthews-Hyman
Marleau-Kadri-Marner
Johnsson-Nylander-Brown
Soshnikov-Komarov-Levio

That 12 plus whatever trade return you get from JVR and Bozak seems like a smarter move to me.
[/quote]

If the return was Parayko and we could throw in Leivo.  Then our 4th line would be
Soshnikov-Gauthier-Komarov
« Last Edit: February 07, 2018, 01:46:56 PM by Big Daddy »

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Re: Leivo asks to traded, Sosh being showcased?
« Reply #37 on: February 07, 2018, 01:44:29 PM »