Author Topic: Komarov: Sell or Keep?  (Read 1172 times)

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Online WhatIfGodWasALeaf

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #30 on: November 21, 2017, 04:41:29 PM »
Do you think St. Louis thought keeping Shattenkirk would give them the best shot at winning that season?

You can't just burn assets, you have to keep recycling or you'll reach the point of having an empty/mediocre pipeline.

All things considered, Soshnikov is probably already better than Komarov and that's not to mention the other guys in the system that can play that role too.

Offline bustaheims

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #31 on: November 21, 2017, 04:55:53 PM »
You can't just burn assets, you have to keep recycling or you'll reach the point of having an empty/mediocre pipeline.

Especially when you're talking about a tertiary asset like Komarov. If you have pieces in place that can replace 80% or more of what they bring and can get another team to overpay for them (which, for guys like Komarov, seems like a fairly common occurence), you make the trade and take the potential minor hit to roster.

When you have guys in the system who seems likely to be able to provide more . . . well, that's a no-brainer. You take the assets another team is willing to part with, and laugh all the way to the bank.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Offline CarltonTheBear

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #32 on: November 21, 2017, 05:01:30 PM »
Hypothetically speaking, let's say that we trade Komarov at the deadline this year. That leaves us with:

Hyman-Matthews-Nylander
Marleau-Kadri-Brown
JVR-Bozak-Marner
Martin-Moore-Soshnikov

I mean, that's still a pretty deep forward group. I've said this about JVR in the past but as long as we have somebody like Connor Brown lining up on the 4th line you can trade a winger and really not notice a huge drop-off (or quite frankly any drop-off) in your top-9. At least at even-strength.

That also still leaves you with Hyman/Brown/Moore/Soshnikov to kill penalties plus Marleau/Marner/Kadri also capable of doing so.

I think it'd be a pretty big mistake to not trade at least one of Komarov/JVR/Bozak at the deadline.

Offline Highlander

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #33 on: November 21, 2017, 05:15:18 PM »
In a cap world, you cannot fall in love with middle six players making more than they are worth, that's a one-way road towards mediocrity. See Montreal, Boston and the Leafs before they properly stripped the junk and committed to a rebuild.

This. Chicago remained viable for as long as they did by ruthlessly moving their outer core players to replenish their ranks with better value propositions. It helps that other GMs are suckers for 'playoff heroes' or heart and soul types from championship dressing rooms and will overpay.

True and then they got Bryan Bickell'd and lost a great young player in Teravainen (sp?). Let's hope the Leafs can avoid that fate.
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Offline Highlander

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #34 on: November 21, 2017, 05:20:23 PM »
In a cap world, you cannot fall in love with middle six players making more than they are worth, that's a one-way road towards mediocrity. See Montreal, Boston and the Leafs before they properly stripped the junk and committed to a rebuild.

This. Chicago remained viable for as long as they did by ruthlessly moving their outer core players to replenish their ranks with better value propositions. It helps that other GMs are suckers for 'playoff heroes' or heart and soul types from championship dressing rooms and will overpay.

True and then they got Bryan Bickell'd and lost a great young player in Teravainen (sp?). Let's hope the Leafs can avoid that fate.
It strikes me that hockey players are like stocks. Don't fall in love with either and understand that I love Komarov, he reminds me so much of Kenny the Rat, but like stocks I fell in love with... they can kill you if you hold on to long, I think its time to trade Komarov while he still has grit and perhaps part of a package for some more picks.  I would like to see Soshnikov, Kapanen and Leivo as part of a full time core.  And I don't buy stocks any more.
"We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children"
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Offline Frank E

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #35 on: November 21, 2017, 05:50:55 PM »
Obviously from a future pipeline perspective, you turn the asset.

But as it stands today, the Leafs' record is 3rd in the league.  If they're in and around 3rd in the league at the trade deadline, do you really mess with your shot at a Cup this year?  I don't think I do.

If I was flirting with being the 10th-12th best team in the league, I think I turn JVR, Bozak, and Komarov...but I don't think I do that if I'm in a position where I'm amongst the very best teams in the league. 

You still have to pick your spots to take a run.

Online Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #36 on: November 21, 2017, 06:11:54 PM »
Obviously from a future pipeline perspective, you turn the asset.

But as it stands today, the Leafs' record is 3rd in the league.  If they're in and around 3rd in the league at the trade deadline, do you really mess with your shot at a Cup this year?  I don't think I do.

If I was flirting with being the 10th-12th best team in the league, I think I turn JVR, Bozak, and Komarov...but I don't think I do that if I'm in a position where I'm amongst the very best teams in the league. 

You still have to pick your spots to take a run.

I just don't think the defense corps is good enough for them to really make a run this year, so even if they sit high in the league approaching the deadline, I move Komarov.  And I like him FWIW.  But Soshnikov can replace him, with potentially more offense to boot.  To me it's a no-brainer.

Online WhatIfGodWasALeaf

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #37 on: November 21, 2017, 08:36:36 PM »
Obviously from a future pipeline perspective, you turn the asset.

But as it stands today, the Leafs' record is 3rd in the league.  If they're in and around 3rd in the league at the trade deadline, do you really mess with your shot at a Cup this year?  I don't think I do.

If I was flirting with being the 10th-12th best team in the league, I think I turn JVR, Bozak, and Komarov...but I don't think I do that if I'm in a position where I'm amongst the very best teams in the league. 

You still have to pick your spots to take a run.

Yes, I'd trade all three, being passive is for losers.

Hyman - God - Marner
Marleau - Kadri - Soshnikov
Kapanen - Nylander - Brown
Martin - Gauthier - Leivo
Moore

Let the kids play and drive up their value while we wait for Liljegren and other extra help on defense.

The three UFA's will fetch a significant return, one or more of which could help sooner rather than later.

If we are going to shelter the third line, I'd rather they shelter young offensive monsters and allow Nylander to take the reigns of his own line.

Offline Nik the Trik

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #38 on: November 21, 2017, 09:26:03 PM »
Obviously from a future pipeline perspective, you turn the asset.

But as it stands today, the Leafs' record is 3rd in the league.  If they're in and around 3rd in the league at the trade deadline, do you really mess with your shot at a Cup this year?  I don't think I do.

If I was flirting with being the 10th-12th best team in the league, I think I turn JVR, Bozak, and Komarov...but I don't think I do that if I'm in a position where I'm amongst the very best teams in the league. 

You still have to pick your spots to take a run.

I don't necessarily disagree with that in theory but I think we have to be realistic about how good the team really is and acknowledge that records can be a little misleading. Right now the Leafs are only 3rd if you ignore measuring them in terms of points per game. They're actually 8th when games played are taken into account, behind teams like Jersey and Vegas. There's been a lot of good from this team this year but it's been pretty rare that I've watched them play a full 60 minutes and thought "this team might really have it this year".

And I really do not for the life of me get the urgency some of you are seeing. There's another season before the big extensions will kick in and even then the team is pretty free of bad contracts. They can't be careless with extension but the idea that their chances are fleeting seems pretty out there to me. They're at the start of their window, not the end.
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Offline bustaheims

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #39 on: November 21, 2017, 10:22:09 PM »
They're at the start of their window, not the end.

That's just it - their window is maybe opening this season. Maybe. Like you, I'm not really convinced they're there yet. They still have a fair amount to learn before I'll believe they're actually Cup contenders.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Offline moon111

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #40 on: November 21, 2017, 11:06:29 PM »
73 Hits, 18 takeaways, major penalty-killer. Babysits Kadri.  <$3 million.  Why can't we have nice things?
R.I.P. Maureen.  You'll always be with us.

Offline Arn

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #41 on: November 22, 2017, 04:35:42 AM »
I'm a massive fan of Komarov. In fact for a while in those really lean tough to watch years he was probably a favourite player just because of the way he went about things and the heart and effort he brought every night. He even had more of a skilled upside than you'd expect at times.

But I love the Leafs more and you have to do what is in the best long term interests of the Leafs, so probably you move him and then you can always talk to him again in the summer if needs be similar to the likes of Winnik. I think he'll get a better deal elsewhere as a UFA than I'd be willing to give him now, but that may change should others move on also (Bozak, JVR primarily)
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Offline Nik the Trik

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #42 on: November 22, 2017, 09:42:09 AM »
I'm a massive fan of Komarov. In fact for a while in those really lean tough to watch years he was probably a favourite player just because of the way he went about things and the heart and effort he brought every night. He even had more of a skilled upside than you'd expect at times.

But I love the Leafs more and you have to do what is in the best long term interests of the Leafs, so probably you move him and then you can always talk to him again in the summer if needs be similar to the likes of Winnik. I think he'll get a better deal elsewhere as a UFA than I'd be willing to give him now, but that may change should others move on also (Bozak, JVR primarily)

Winnik also seems like a perfect comparison in terms of return. He returned a 2nd and a 4th the first time(and Zach Sill) and a 2nd and Connor Carrick the second time(while eating the Laich contract). You have to figure Komarov could fetch at least that. More if he's as valuable as some seem to think.
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Offline Arn

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #43 on: November 22, 2017, 10:56:04 AM »
I would say that's fair - I can definitely see someone potentially offering a little more than you may normally expect due to "intangibles" and "grit" that would associated with the type of player Komarov is
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Offline Frank E

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #44 on: November 22, 2017, 11:08:43 AM »
I would say that's fair - I can definitely see someone potentially offering a little more than you may normally expect due to "intangibles" and "grit" that would associated with the type of player Komarov is

The guy is a literal freight train!

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Re: Komarov: Sell or Keep?
« Reply #44 on: November 22, 2017, 11:08:43 AM »