Author Topic: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion  (Read 18099 times)

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Offline Guru Tugginmypuddah

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #255 on: October 31, 2017, 06:07:00 PM »

Shake and Bake...
Finally Babs is getting it. Perhaps Lou put him in a headlock. Half Nelson

I like to imagine a figure four leg lock.

Offline herman

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #256 on: October 31, 2017, 06:32:26 PM »
Like I mentioned in the GDT, something in Andersen's game was definitely off.
https://theathletic.com/142816/2017/10/31/frederik-andersens-latest-techincal-struggle-and-how-he-can-fix-it/

Good news: it's easily fixable.

Offline sickbeast

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #257 on: November 01, 2017, 06:41:58 PM »
The Leafs have a really tough schedule the next few games.  Chances are they will come out at around .500.  Not good at all considering their hot start.  I really think Babcock is going to be able to fix this though.  The opposing teams have figured out how to neutralize the Leafs' offense, and the Leafs aren't much of a team with their offense neutralized.  Babcock just needs to figure this out, and I think he will.  Andersen hasn't been bad, either.  The defense and team play in front of him hasn't been good enough.  Sure he could be better but he is the last guy they should be blaming or worrying about.

I notice that the opposing teams are lining up five guys on their defensive blue line and then the Leafs are unable to penetrate the zone.  The Leafs need a new strategy, it might be dump and chase or something else.  It's hard to carry the puck over the line with five guys standing there waiting for you.


Offline CarltonTheBear

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #259 on: November 03, 2017, 11:42:28 AM »
Mike Kelly highlighting a few plays that make Connor Brown the top offensive zone stick check'er (by whatever his and his company's criteria for that is):


I get why Babcock likes Hyman on that top line but most of what he does in terms of board work Brown can do just as well, and he has a much better scoring touch. Both are right-handed shots so there's no difference there. Brown might not have as much experience on the left side but I don't think Hyman did either when he first went there. You can't tell me a player as smart as Brown wouldn't be able to figure things out on his off-wing.

Offline herman

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #260 on: November 03, 2017, 11:54:10 AM »
Hyman and Brown are in the same bucket of players in my mind: super useful utility complements on the wings. They do slightly different things but the same way (you see them, they be work work work work work work). Neither will drive play themselves in transition, but they will extend your opportunities with their forecheck, positioning, and sheer effort. Brown uses the stick more, while Hyman is all about bashing in and parking that booty on the other guy's gloves.

The reasons Hyman gets the nod over Brown with Matthews - Nylander:
- Brown is a better scorer (because he shoots more) and other lines need the scoring more
- Hyman is 20 lbs thicker

Offline Coco-puffs

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #261 on: November 03, 2017, 11:57:58 AM »
CtB.  I think Brown would do better than Hyman on his off wing.  Hyman really struggles to find his linemates when he drives wide with the puck.  Head down and zero vision way too often.  I don't see how Brown couldn't do better. 

However, I really like the chemistry of that top line right now.  If anything, I'd really like to see Nylander and Hyman switch just to see if Hyman could be more effective on the right side.  Other than the occasional board battles in his own zone, I don't think Nylander would have any issue playing his off-wing while I think Hyman would be more effective.

Offline CarltonTheBear

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #262 on: November 03, 2017, 12:02:28 PM »
However, I really like the chemistry of that top line right now.  If anything, I'd really like to see Nylander and Hyman switch just to see if Hyman could be more effective on the right side.  Other than the occasional board battles in his own zone, I don't think Nylander would have any issue playing his off-wing while I think Hyman would be more effective.

Yeah, that wouldn't be a bad idea. It's definitely possible that some of Hyman's struggles offensively could be attributed to him playing his off-wing.

Offline Frank E

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #263 on: November 03, 2017, 12:10:45 PM »
Mike Kelly highlighting a few plays that make Connor Brown the top offensive zone stick check'er (by whatever his and his company's criteria for that is):

I get why Babcock likes Hyman on that top line but most of what he does in terms of board work Brown can do just as well, and he has a much better scoring touch. Both are right-handed shots so there's no difference there. Brown might not have as much experience on the left side but I don't think Hyman did either when he first went there. You can't tell me a player as smart as Brown wouldn't be able to figure things out on his off-wing.

Interestingly, each of the plays on the video shows that Brown is actually working the left side!

Offline WhatIfGodWasALeaf

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #264 on: November 03, 2017, 12:14:28 PM »
I might be off, but in modern hockey systems, isn't the notion of right and left winger pretty antiquated outside of faceoffs?

It's all F1, F2 and F3 and constantly fluid while in play.


Offline Coco-puffs

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #265 on: November 03, 2017, 12:22:52 PM »
However, I really like the chemistry of that top line right now.  If anything, I'd really like to see Nylander and Hyman switch just to see if Hyman could be more effective on the right side.  Other than the occasional board battles in his own zone, I don't think Nylander would have any issue playing his off-wing while I think Hyman would be more effective.

Yeah, that wouldn't be a bad idea. It's definitely possible that some of Hyman's struggles offensively could be attributed to him playing his off-wing.

Oh yeah for sure.  I don't think switching sides will work miracles for him but I do think it will help- especially with making passes when he drives the net.  Right now, on his off-side he just puts his head down and bulls to the net.  Maybe that won't change, but being on your strong side makes it easier to make a quick pass. 

If he's going to stay on his off-side, he needs to learn to start driving wide, get his dman to turn, then stop up and curl at the hashmarks so he can make a pass to whomever is coming on the next wave.  He's too predictable right now, always just driving the net with the puck.

Offline Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #266 on: November 03, 2017, 12:33:25 PM »
However, I really like the chemistry of that top line right now.  If anything, I'd really like to see Nylander and Hyman switch just to see if Hyman could be more effective on the right side.  Other than the occasional board battles in his own zone, I don't think Nylander would have any issue playing his off-wing while I think Hyman would be more effective.

Yeah, that wouldn't be a bad idea. It's definitely possible that some of Hyman's struggles offensively could be attributed to him playing his off-wing.

Oh yeah for sure.  I don't think switching sides will work miracles for him but I do think it will help- especially with making passes when he drives the net.  Right now, on his off-side he just puts his head down and bulls to the net.  Maybe that won't change, but being on your strong side makes it easier to make a quick pass. 

If he's going to stay on his off-side, he needs to learn to start driving wide, get his dman to turn, then stop up and curl at the hashmarks so he can make a pass to whomever is coming on the next wave.  He's too predictable right now, always just driving the net with the puck.

This is good thinking, and probably worth trying, but to me a higher priority would be to drop Leo to the 4th line and find somebody to play with Kadri and Kapanen.  Marner?

Offline herman

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #267 on: November 03, 2017, 01:26:16 PM »
I might be off, but in modern hockey systems, isn't the notion of right and left winger pretty antiquated outside of faceoffs?

It's all F1, F2 and F3 and constantly fluid while in play.

This.

Another aspect of Hyman's game that is slightly overlooked because it doesn't show up on the spreadsheets: he's the guy in the crease taking out one defender and obstructing about 40% of a goaltender's mobility/vision.

Matthews' goal against San Jose:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSzm03QRc7M

Shows off Nylander as LW, which works*, but will limit his passing capabilities as he circles behind the net (and I'd rather limit Hyman's offense for the sake of Nylander getting more options), as well as Hyman's Snorlax impression in front of Jones. So he doesn't really touch the puck, but he screens the initial shot to generate the rebound, and ties up Justin Braun by taking away his ability to use his stick to clear the puck, and Matthews swoops by with a little kick up play on the loose puck to snap it home.

* I'd put Nylander on LW if he was the designated shooter on the line (i.e. if there was another distributor). On a line with Matthews though, we're better off with Nylander's righty shot coming up the right wing to give Matthews someone to transition up the ice with more easily. It's also why I want to see Marner with Kadri (or Matthews) because I think he's more effective with an LC.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2017, 01:31:31 PM by herman »

Offline hockeyfan1

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #268 on: November 03, 2017, 04:09:59 PM »
Like I mentioned in the GDT, something in Andersen's game was definitely off.
https://theathletic.com/142816/2017/10/31/frederik-andersens-latest-techincal-struggle-and-how-he-can-fix-it/

Good news: it's easily fixable.


As long as he continues to have trouble with the LD - MD shots, that will hamper him.  Though he's best with the HD shots, the rest is definitely fixable.  The charts will tell the tale.

Offline herman

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #269 on: November 03, 2017, 04:39:49 PM »
Like I mentioned in the GDT, something in Andersen's game was definitely off.
https://theathletic.com/142816/2017/10/31/frederik-andersens-latest-techincal-struggle-and-how-he-can-fix-it/

Good news: it's easily fixable.


As long as he continues to have trouble with the LD - MD shots, that will hamper him.  Though he's best with the HD shots, the rest is definitely fixable.  The charts will tell the tale.

I think he's already sorted it out, actually.

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Re: 2017-18 Toronto Maple Leafs - General Discussion
« Reply #269 on: November 03, 2017, 04:39:49 PM »