Author Topic: Armchair GM 2017-2018  (Read 11233 times)

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Offline herman

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #135 on: August 23, 2017, 09:24:28 AM »
This article here, from about a year ago, has a pretty big write-up on him: http://pucksandrecreation.com/across-the-pond-european-ufas-with-nhl-future-part-2/

Certainly sounds like an intriguing player. Wonder if there's any way around that final year of his KHL deal.

If he wanted to, he could buy out his final year, a la Petri Kontiola.
I like the sound of his profile, as he has the tools and gumption to be a big blueline meanie but has decided to use his skating and hands for goal scoring instead.

Offline CarltonTheBear

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #136 on: September 15, 2017, 09:59:50 AM »

Hmmmmmmmmm. A right fit eh? If only there was a centre around who had experience with their big-time winger who hasn't exactly seemed to click 100% with their big-2 centres.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2017, 10:03:03 AM by CarltonTheBear »

Offline Significantly Insignificant

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #137 on: September 15, 2017, 10:18:15 AM »

Hmmmmmmmmm. A right fit eh? If only there was a centre around who had experience with their big-time winger who hasn't exactly seemed to click 100% with their big-2 centres.

I was thinking that too, but what does Pittsburgh have at this point to offer up other than late first round picks?
"Progress lies not in enhancing what is, but in advancing toward what will be. - Khalil Gibran

Offline CarltonTheBear

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #138 on: September 15, 2017, 10:23:48 AM »
I was thinking that too, but what does Pittsburgh have at this point to offer up other than late first round picks?

Yeah, that's about it. Pronman ranked them as the worst prospect pool in the league this summer. Which is incredibly fair. After Daniel Sprong, who isn't going anywhere, they've basically got nothing.

Offline Nik the Trik

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #139 on: September 15, 2017, 10:27:20 AM »
I was thinking that too, but what does Pittsburgh have at this point to offer up other than late first round picks?

By not trading Bozak by now, the idea that you're going to get substantially more for him than a late first round pick is pretty tenuous.
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Offline Coco-puffs

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #140 on: September 15, 2017, 12:03:59 PM »
I was thinking that too, but what does Pittsburgh have at this point to offer up other than late first round picks?

By not trading Bozak by now, the idea that you're going to get substantially more for him than a late first round pick is pretty tenuous.

Or, you know, the value of having him in our lineup all year might just outweigh that late first round pick?  Especially if your options for 3rd line center are Brooks or Aaltonen  (if Babcock doesn't think Nylander is ready to play C)

Offline Nik the Trik

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #141 on: September 15, 2017, 12:14:04 PM »
Or, you know, the value of having him in our lineup all year might just outweigh that late first round pick?  Especially if your options for 3rd line center are Brooks or Aaltonen  (if Babcock doesn't think Nylander is ready to play C)

I think the team has more options there. You could bump Moore up to 3rd and use Fehr as the 4th line C in a pinch. Likewise you could use a first round pick to potentially shop around for a 3rd line C who might be around a little longer.

Or, you know, alternately Mike Babcock could maybe consider the idea of using a temporarily sub-optimal lineup that would help the team's prospect base instead of one that matches exactly what he wants now now now.
Give a man the reputation of an early riser and he can sleep 'til noon
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Offline CarltonTheBear

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #142 on: September 15, 2017, 12:19:27 PM »
I think you can make the argument he's a better option on the wing, but Marleau can also play centre.

Offline Nik the Trik

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #143 on: September 15, 2017, 12:27:53 PM »
I think you can make the argument he's a better option on the wing, but Marleau can also play centre.

I think if push came to shove there are a number of guys you could get away with there. Marleau and Nylander being two, Komarov being a third...

Honestly, find a guy who can skate with Marner and JVR and isn't Stonehands McGee and what's the low end point total? 40? 45?
Give a man the reputation of an early riser and he can sleep 'til noon
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Offline herman

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #144 on: September 15, 2017, 01:03:00 PM »
Marner's line isn't all that centre dependent anyway. Hyman is also a centre, btw  8)

Offline Coco-puffs

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #145 on: September 15, 2017, 01:09:12 PM »
Or, you know, the value of having him in our lineup all year might just outweigh that late first round pick?  Especially if your options for 3rd line center are Brooks or Aaltonen  (if Babcock doesn't think Nylander is ready to play C)

I think the team has more options there. You could bump Moore up to 3rd and use Fehr as the 4th line C in a pinch. Likewise you could use a first round pick to potentially shop around for a 3rd line C who might be around a little longer.

Or, you know, alternately Mike Babcock could maybe consider the idea of using a temporarily sub-optimal lineup that would help the team's prospect base instead of one that matches exactly what he wants now now now.

a)  Dominic Moore is not someone you want playing above the 4th line. 
b)  Sure, you could try and flip that 1st rounder back to someone else for someone who will be here longer-term.  But, if your long term plan is to play Nylander there then why?  Also, I think that type of move is much easier said than done.
c)  Someone mentioned Marleau... someone in the analytics community pointed out his results in the middle have not been good for a couple of years now and should only be considered a winger going forward.
c)  Sub-optimal lineup- I don't think the Leafs have that large a margin for getting into the playoffs that they should go sub-optimal.  Especially if we aren't as lucky on the injury front.

With all that said- I do like the idea of Nylander moving to center now and gaining that asset.  Also opens a spot on wing for one our our younger players who deserve it (Leivo, Kapanen).  The problem is, what happens if we have an injury to Kadri or Matthews.  You've already moved Nylander there, who probably needs sheltered minutes down the middle, and now you are going into Aaltonen and Brooks territory.  Bozak provides insurance there that might be worth not trading him for a late first round pick.


Offline bustaheims

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #146 on: September 15, 2017, 01:22:33 PM »
Bozak provides insurance there that might be worth not trading him for a late first round pick.

Maybe, but that's some pretty short-term thinking. Bozak is extremely unlikely to be re-signed, the team already needs to be working towards resolving the scenarios you've laid out. As others have pointed out, there are plenty short-term injury fill-ins already in the organization; and, should Kadri or Matthews suffer a more significant injury, they're in a bad spot, regardless of whether or not Bozak is on-board. All Bozak does is mitigate some of the damage - and likely not enough to keep them in a position in the standings that's desirable, which really makes the value of keeping him as insurance virtually nil. Basically, from the looks of things, all scenarios point to getting a quality asset like a 1st round pick now being the better option for the team.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Offline Bullfrog

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #147 on: September 15, 2017, 01:34:17 PM »
I've grown to really appreciate Bozak. But if someone's offering a late first, I'll go pack his bags for him.

Offline Significantly Insignificant

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #148 on: September 15, 2017, 01:34:50 PM »
I was thinking that too, but what does Pittsburgh have at this point to offer up other than late first round picks?

By not trading Bozak by now, the idea that you're going to get substantially more for him than a late first round pick is pretty tenuous.

I get that Bozak isn't going to bring in a truckload.  Ideally, he would be dealt for a close to ready prospect rather than a pick, which is where my previous statement is coming from.  In that case dealing with a team like Nashville would make more sense.  However, I get the whole it takes two scenario when it comes to trades. 

It would be nice for management to make a statement with Bozak and JVR, rather than just leaving the future sort of twisting in the wind.  My fear is that they sign JVR to a long term 6-7 million dollar deal for next season.
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Offline Coco-puffs

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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #149 on: September 15, 2017, 01:43:21 PM »
Bozak provides insurance there that might be worth not trading him for a late first round pick.

Maybe, but that's some pretty short-term thinking. Bozak is extremely unlikely to be re-signed, the team already needs to be working towards resolving the scenarios you've laid out. As others have pointed out, there are plenty short-term injury fill-ins already in the organization; and, should Kadri or Matthews suffer a more significant injury, they're in a bad spot, regardless of whether or not Bozak is on-board. All Bozak does is mitigate some of the damage - and likely not enough to keep them in a position in the standings that's desirable, which really makes the value of keeping him as insurance virtually nil. Basically, from the looks of things, all scenarios point to getting a quality asset like a 1st round pick now being the better option for the team.

Management's decisions shouldn't entirely be based on long-term thinking.  There needs to be a balance.  Considering this team has a window of opportunity now, with all of the big three on entry-level deals, short term thinking isn't a bad thing.  I believe the odds-makers have the Leafs in the Top 10 to win the cup at 14-1, tied with Tampa for best in our division.  Trade Bozak away and that takes a hit.  His value as "insurance for injuries" is much more than nil.  Kadri goes down in February for 4-6 weeks:  Matthews - Bozak - Nylander will probably still get you in the playoffs.  Matthews - Nylander - Brooks/Aaltonen?  I have my doubts.  With Kadri returning for the playoffs, you are back to a contender.  Don't get in, doesn't matter if you have a healthy lineup at the end of the season.

I think there is too much belief that losing players to UFA is a terrible thing and you should always extract value when you can.   That is entirely true for a team that isn't expected to make the playoffs.  Even for some bubble teams, it probably makes sense.  But, Top-10 team?  Most top-10 teams try and bolster their lineups at the trade deadline- guess what they do- they trade late 1st round picks for players who's deals are about to expire.

The Leafs will NEVER have the depth they have this year.  The big 3, once their entry-level deals expire, are going to command too much cap space and unless UFA's are taking big discounts to come here for a shot at the cup.  Jake Gardiner only has 2 years left on his current deal.  Might as well go for it these next two years.  They aren't mortgaging their future to do so.  I'm not advocating for them to trade their 1st round picks to bolster the lineup at this stage- that would definitely be too short term in thinking. 


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Re: Armchair GM 2017-2018
« Reply #149 on: September 15, 2017, 01:43:21 PM »