Author Topic: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?  (Read 5176 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline TBLeafer

  • Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 1856
  • Gender: Male
  • One with the Shanaplan!
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #30 on: October 04, 2016, 11:51:57 AM »
Greening, Hyman, Brown, Leivo, Sosh (already starting on the Marlies due to injury).

They could go the Corrado route with Yak.  Get him used to the system and the team.  Once he has the confidence in Babs to give him some ice, try him out.  Maybe he sticks, maybe he doesn't.  If he doesn't, waive him and you've lost nothing. 

Offline Nik the Trik

  • Sittler Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 21709
  • Some Guy On a Message Board
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #31 on: October 04, 2016, 12:17:32 PM »

Even if it's a move with a fairly limited downside I'm struggling to see it as one with any real upside either. In an absolute best case scenario Yakupov has a good year(taking valuable time in a scoring role/PP unit) on a Leafs team that probably won't be in a playoff spot and then the team has to decide whether or not to re-sign him on the basis of one good year in a contract year. He'd have limited trade value too as, again, whoever traded for him would have to be comfortable signing him on the basis of one good year.
Give a man the reputation of an early riser and he can sleep 'til noon
-Mark Twain

Offline TBLeafer

  • Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 1856
  • Gender: Male
  • One with the Shanaplan!
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #32 on: October 04, 2016, 12:20:40 PM »
A one year bridge contract with a league minimum raise for a qualifying offer could see to that.

Or he could get his QO and get picked up by Vegas.

Offline Nik the Trik

  • Sittler Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 21709
  • Some Guy On a Message Board
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #33 on: October 04, 2016, 12:29:16 PM »
A one year bridge contract with a league minimum raise for a qualifying offer could see to that.

Which is what I'm saying. There's value in this if he has a good year and then if he's interested in signing a super-team friendly deal when there might be real KHL money on the table.

So limited upside, disruptive to the team's plans, unlikely success...hard pass.
Give a man the reputation of an early riser and he can sleep 'til noon
-Mark Twain

Offline TBLeafer

  • Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 1856
  • Gender: Male
  • One with the Shanaplan!
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #34 on: October 04, 2016, 12:37:43 PM »
A one year bridge contract with a league minimum raise for a qualifying offer could see to that.

Which is what I'm saying. There's value in this if he has a good year and then if he's interested in signing a super-team friendly deal when there might be real KHL money on the table.

So limited upside, disruptive to the team's plans, unlikely success...hard pass.

How is it disruptive to the team's plans again?  I'm sorry I thought picking up a waived player if they think he contribute has already happened with Corrado and will continue to.  Leafs have right of first refusal given their 30th place standing on any waived player.

IF Yak hits the waiver wire, the Leafs ABSOLUTELY snag him.

Online leafsjunkie

  • Marlie
  • **
  • Posts: 170
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #35 on: October 04, 2016, 12:39:46 PM »
Yeah, they will and they'll play him on Stamkos line, too?  ::)

Offline Nik the Trik

  • Sittler Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 21709
  • Some Guy On a Message Board
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #36 on: October 04, 2016, 01:34:18 PM »
How is it disruptive to the team's plans again? 

Seems fairly straightforward. The argument is that for Yakupov to have a good year he needs to get offensive opportunities with a good C. The Leafs have plans for most of those spots. Bringing in Yakupov and inserting him into the lineup would necessarily change those plans.
Give a man the reputation of an early riser and he can sleep 'til noon
-Mark Twain

Offline TBLeafer

  • Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 1856
  • Gender: Male
  • One with the Shanaplan!
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #37 on: October 04, 2016, 01:59:21 PM »
How is it disruptive to the team's plans again? 

Seems fairly straightforward. The argument is that for Yakupov to have a good year he needs to get offensive opportunities with a good C. The Leafs have plans for most of those spots. Bringing in Yakupov and inserting him into the lineup would necessarily change those plans.

Nah, they can roll 3 scoring lines and a grinding line with all the young skill they'll have.  Like with everyone else, Yak would have to EARN every inch.  If he does, great.  We find ourselves another good young player we didn't need to give up any assets for.  If not, we waive him (at which point he'll probably clear) and move on to the next player on the depth chart.

The plan was to not give away top assets to build a team.  Those top assets are now in place.  Now its about finding the right mix.  IF he waived, IMO its worth finding out whether Yak fits into that mix or not.

Offline Tigger

  • All Star
  • *****
  • Posts: 6368
  • You can play
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #38 on: October 04, 2016, 02:36:33 PM »
Just for kicks, what's the likelihood of this?

Just at a glance it seems like the sort of thing that might happen but probably not soon. According to this here from the Edmonton Journal it looks like Yakupov is very much on the fringe of the roster but, that said, they seem pretty certain he's still going to make the team.

http://www.theprovince.com/sports/hockey/edmonton-oilers/eight+oilers+points+ponder+nail+yakupov+likely/12248649/story.html

So this should probably be a general rumour rather than a media rumour. I can't find anything that suggests him being waived is imminent.

Yeah, I doubt they're going to waive him at this point too, and if there's little interest in acquiring a recent 1stOA for nothing, well, that speaks volumes.
"My father was born shortly after the Wright Brothers" Charlie Duke

Offline Nik the Trik

  • Sittler Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 21709
  • Some Guy On a Message Board
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #39 on: October 04, 2016, 02:46:11 PM »
Nah, they can roll 3 scoring lines and a grinding line with all the young skill they'll have.

It's not really debatable. Right now that's either already the plan and they have guys in mind for those spots or that's not the plan. Either way bringing in Yakupov and putting him in one of those spots or going with three scoring lines would change things. I appreciate that you're saying you think it would be a positive change but that's immaterial to the fact that it would be a change.
Give a man the reputation of an early riser and he can sleep 'til noon
-Mark Twain

Offline TBLeafer

  • Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 1856
  • Gender: Male
  • One with the Shanaplan!
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #40 on: October 04, 2016, 03:13:40 PM »
Nah, they can roll 3 scoring lines and a grinding line with all the young skill they'll have.

It's not really debatable. Right now that's either already the plan and they have guys in mind for those spots or that's not the plan. Either way bringing in Yakupov and putting him in one of those spots or going with three scoring lines would change things. I appreciate that you're saying you think it would be a positive change but that's immaterial to the fact that it would be a change.

Not really.  Take Brown for instance.  While he does work hard at both ends of the ice, he isn't exactly known for his defensive ability on RW.  I can see Yak taking his spot, on the right side with Bozak, who is used to playing with a high skill offensive winger.  Just the quality of that skilled winger, goes up.  The plan doesn't change.

As for this season's team from last season's team at the start of the season.  The roster will already be more than 50% changed.

The roster at camp changes on a nightly basis.  Injuries cause change to the roster.  So in the case of the roster personnel, you are correct, it would be a change.

In terms of the plan, not so much.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2016, 03:16:34 PM by TBLeafer »

Offline Nik the Trik

  • Sittler Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 21709
  • Some Guy On a Message Board
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #41 on: October 04, 2016, 03:36:25 PM »
Not really.  Take Brown for instance.  While he does work hard at both ends of the ice, he isn't exactly known for his defensive ability on RW.  I can see Yak taking his spot, on the right side with Bozak, who is used to playing with a high skill offensive winger.  Just the quality of that skilled winger, goes up.  The plan doesn't change.

Well, leaving aside the fact that I don't think Brown is in that spot right now I think it's important to point out that none of these things happen in isolation. Using your example, sure, Yakupov comes in and Brown goes out. But what happens to Brown? Is he a Marlie then? If so, who does he play with on the Marlies? The Marlies already have a ton of interesting prospects fighting for spots, who does he push down? Who gets sent to Orlando? How does it effect the strategy, say, of the Marlies PP which you would assume is tailored to the strengths of the players on it rather than simply being a one-size fits all affair. These are all factors to be considered. All of those things are part of the various plans the team has going forward, both for individuals and the teams in question.

Which is were we get back to the point I was making. "Disruptive to the team's plans" was second in a list of three and they're all connected. If I thought it was a move with higher upside or likelier to succeed, then those questions would be less important. As is, I wouldn't shuffle around the Leafs or Marlies roster to see if Yakupov would be a fit. He just hasn't shown enough in Edmonton and the fact that McLellan seems to have no spot for him is pretty telling.

But don't worry. You've made it clear you would claim Nail Yakupov if he hits waivers.
Give a man the reputation of an early riser and he can sleep 'til noon
-Mark Twain

Offline TBLeafer

  • Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 1856
  • Gender: Male
  • One with the Shanaplan!
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #42 on: October 04, 2016, 04:06:53 PM »
Not really.  Take Brown for instance.  While he does work hard at both ends of the ice, he isn't exactly known for his defensive ability on RW.  I can see Yak taking his spot, on the right side with Bozak, who is used to playing with a high skill offensive winger.  Just the quality of that skilled winger, goes up.  The plan doesn't change.

Well, leaving aside the fact that I don't think Brown is in that spot right now I think it's important to point out that none of these things happen in isolation. Using your example, sure, Yakupov comes in and Brown goes out. But what happens to Brown? Is he a Marlie then? If so, who does he play with on the Marlies? The Marlies already have a ton of interesting prospects fighting for spots, who does he push down? Who gets sent to Orlando? How does it effect the strategy, say, of the Marlies PP which you would assume is tailored to the strengths of the players on it rather than simply being a one-size fits all affair. These are all factors to be considered. All of those things are part of the various plans the team has going forward, both for individuals and the teams in question.

Which is were we get back to the point I was making. "Disruptive to the team's plans" was second in a list of three and they're all connected. If I thought it was a move with higher upside or likelier to succeed, then those questions would be less important. As is, I wouldn't shuffle around the Leafs or Marlies roster to see if Yakupov would be a fit. He just hasn't shown enough in Edmonton and the fact that McLellan seems to have no spot for him is pretty telling.

But don't worry. You've made it clear you would claim Nail Yakupov if he hits waivers.

So in other words. Every time a professional sports team, or any team for that matter brings in an outside player not in their team's current system, it is disruptive to their team building plans, got it.

Yes we have a deep prospect pool now.  Its a good problem to have.  Yes it could set the timeline back a bit from minor league to pro for Brown.  But maybe by only a month or two if Yak still busts under Babs, should they pick him up off waivers.  They won't be trading for him.

This kinda thing happens all the time.  Teams and players deal.

Offline Nik the Trik

  • Sittler Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 21709
  • Some Guy On a Message Board
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #43 on: October 04, 2016, 04:20:06 PM »
\
So in other words. Every time a professional sports team, or any team for that matter brings in an outside player not in their team's current system, it is disruptive to their team building plans, got it.

Well, no. Bringing in a player during the off-season doesn't disrupt a plan already in place because the off-season is when teams start formulating their ideas and looking for holes to fill. Bringing in someone like Enroth didn't change their plan because clearly their plan was to acquire a back-up goalie via free agency. A team can, on its own, decide to pursue the best available back-up goalie in the off-season. You can't game plan around a specific player being made available on waivers.

Right now, the Leafs have to formulate a plan based on the idea that Yakupov isn't available. That plan is in place. Bringing him in would change things. That is incontrovertibly true.

But, again, change isn't necessarily a positive or negative thing. Like I said, "disrupting the plans" was one of three connected reasons. If you were bringing in someone demonstrably better than the options they already had, that disruption would be less of a concern. As is, part of my rationale for why I wouldn't claim him is that he doesn't present enough of an upgrade to shake things up.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2016, 04:25:32 PM by Nik the Trik »
Give a man the reputation of an early riser and he can sleep 'til noon
-Mark Twain

Offline TBLeafer

  • Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 1856
  • Gender: Male
  • One with the Shanaplan!
    • View Profile
Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #44 on: October 04, 2016, 04:32:09 PM »
\
So in other words. Every time a professional sports team, or any team for that matter brings in an outside player not in their team's current system, it is disruptive to their team building plans, got it.

Well, no. Bringing in a player during the off-season doesn't disrupt a plan already in place because the off-season is when teams start formulating their ideas and looking for holes to fill. Bringing in someone like Enroth didn't change their plan because clearly their plan was to acquire a back-up goalie via free agency. A team can, on its own, decide to pursue the best available back-up goalie in the off-season. You can't game plan around a specific player being made available on waivers.

Right now, the Leafs have to formulate a plan based on the idea that Yakupov isn't available. That plan is in place. Bringing him in would change things. That is incontrovertibly true.

But, again, change isn't necessarily a positive or negative thing. Like I said, "disrupting the plans" was one of three connected reasons. If you were bringing in someone demonstrably better than the options they already had, that disruption would be less of a concern. As is, part of my rationale for why I wouldn't claim him is that he doesn't present enough of an upgrade to shake things up.

Gotcha.  Which is why IMO he'd get the Corrado treatment from last season to ensure that disruption wouldn't be a concern if/when they give him his first game.

TMLfans.ca

Re: Should the Leafs grab Yakupov if he's Waived?
« Reply #44 on: October 04, 2016, 04:32:09 PM »